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According to Arturo that is on a standard Acer. He did a lot of trial and error but I think as long as I'm just doing LCDs this will be fine.
well, you really won’t. Grab the model number of the acer and look it up. It probably supports gsync or freesync, or has very wide tolerance for sync signal for an lcd. I’m just reinforcing this since you don’t wanna show up to an event and plug it into an untested lcd and not have it work. The MK pcbs + ossc will not work out of the box with most lcd panels. If you also got yourself one that worked, and brought it along, then you’re fine. But if you just bring the system and expect it to work with any random flat panel you’re gonna have a frustrating experience.

If you poke around there are some people who can’t even get CPS2 to sync with marqs new hdmi upgrade, and that’s like 59.7hz. It’s because the ossc isn’t doing anything to adjust the sync rate.

Also worth asking if Arturo’s acer LCD is using hdmi or component video. Hdmi is usually very strict for sync while analog inputs may be more forgiving.

Just don’t want you to run into a competition and be bummed out!
 
worth considering these for the price if you already have UD-USB

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Those MK fight sticks are perfect. I am planning to to rewire mine for db15 so no usb decoder or undamned adapters are needed.
 
Those MK fight sticks are perfect. I am planning to to rewire mine for db15 so no usb decoder or undamned adapters are needed.
I want to do the same!

Nothing against Undamned, I love his products but I think if you are already dealing with lag from a LCD panel...
Why risking adding anymore? It's simply not worth it, esp when it can be so easily avoided with a new harness.

I'm not just talking about Undamned adapters too, the PCB inside the stick can add to this (end-to-end lag value) tremendously.
well, you really won’t. Grab the model number of the acer and look it up. It probably supports gsync or freesync, or has very wide tolerance for sync signal for an lcd. I’m just reinforcing this since you don’t wanna show up to an event and plug it into an untested lcd and not have it work.
He speaks the truth @UMKShock beware!
The ENTIRE Midway family outputs these crazy low/oddball syn values nothing but special monitors will display (without a iScan DVDO).
wcqFYRq.jpg


You also need to be aware of the custom values needed for the OSSC to properly display the Midway family.
Mostly notably as you can see from my LCD screen, you need to increase the active v-pixel height above 240 (I used 300 and this seems to have let the OSSC find the value itself at 288).

I love my BenQ gaming, it works directly off the OSSC with everything!
c5aovqS.jpg


Even my precious B6 OLED don't work with everything, only most things, and yea Midway is NOT one that works directly (needs iScan DVDO).
ALL Vewlix LCDs NEED iScan DVDO (F, L, L-AMI, Diamond old, Diamond new).
AvS2qxi.jpg
 
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Quick tangent...

Last month I went to an arcade and played through MK1 & 2 and remembered how much I love the early MK's and how much I HATE the controls... Since were talking about controls and tournament viability here, what do they allow in the "official" scene / tournaments? Is it shrugged upon to not use the cross setup? What do people typically use aside from that for MK games? I see Jassin using the vewlix style setup, just wondering how it feels. I may have to load it up in mame and give it a shot. Not sure how the community feels about anything other than the default controls.
 
I see Jassin using the vewlix style setup, just wondering how it feels.
Like total shit!
That VXL shot? Yea it was more or less a "cuz they said I couldn't do it with real hardware" shot...
It was unplayable/bad with Sanwa sticks/buttons at best.

Why do you think I want to buy some of the limited sticks (I want this version)? ;)
A89absQ.jpg


I have since upgraded just my Vewlix Diamond (white) with @Hadouken Arcade 's custom joystick adapter.
The LS-32 with a high tension spring and a battop feels... better... but its no Happ compo.
Kl6SomO.jpg


Buttons are fine, I use this layout...
[HP][X][HK][X]
[LP][BL][LH]


Run button is for LameKombat3+, real fighters don't rely on flashy gimmicks and dial-a-combos.
 
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Just don’t want you to run into a competition and be bummed out!
We'll definitely test it, I have a couple different types of ASUS monitors we use for tournaments, and if I have to get one specific LCD for this project.
worth considering these for the price if you already have UD-USB
I have 5 or 6 MK layout American style sticks, all are either PS3/360 or Brooks Universal converted so we're good to go. I have two of those PDP sticks as well.
Those MK fight sticks are perfect. I am planning to to rewire mine for db15 so no usb decoder or undamned adapters are needed.
Perfect? Not exactly, but they are definitely acceptable for casual play. The first time I used one was when I tested MK9 in 2011 at NetherRealm Studios. I brought my own stick with me because I didn't think they would have any, but they did so that was great. The biggest issue is that the buttons are further from the stick than normal, which isn't too terrible, however the actual parts are slightly sub par, again not really too terrible but pro/picky players notice. I also have 4 Qanba sticks, Obsidians and a Crystal, which some players like to use but those are mainly when I run casual setups for PS4 games at conventions, since no walk ups ever bring sticks, and rarely controllers.

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The reason why I'm going with Undamned adapters is because when we do run classic MK tournaments, we draw people who bring their own pads and sticks, so we want to be able to accommodate them, and don't expect them to mod their controllers for DB15. This is why we've stuck with MAME for so long. We absolutely hate having to restart and reconfigure setups for new controllers, so 90% of the time we run with 2 PS2 pads, and 2 sticks mapped at all times, and save a config for that. It's a nightmare and this would be an interesting change, and it might not be worth it either. I would definitely consider having 2 sticks and 2 pads wired directly for DB15 though, that's for sure.
Nothing against Undamned, I love his products but I think if you are already dealing with lag from a LCD panel...

Why risking adding anymore? It's simply not worth it, esp when it can be so easily avoided with a new harness.

I'm not just talking about Undamned adapters too, the PCB inside the stick can add to this (end-to-end lag value) tremendously.
He speaks the truth @UMKShock beware!The ENTIRE Midway family outputs these crazy low/oddball syn values nothing but special monitors will display (without a iScan DVDO).



You also need to be aware of the custom values needed for the OSSC to properly display the Midway family.
Mostly notably as you can see from my LCD screen, you need to increase the active v-pixel height above 240 (I used 300 and this seems to have let the OSSC find the value itself at 288).
Yeah these are issues we're aware of, and we'll see what has to be done, obviously I want it to work and I'm taking all the advice from this thread into consideration. In terms of lag, we're talking about reducing by frames in exchange for milliseconds I THINK and also input drops and miscellaneous bugs that we suffer with on MAME.
Quick tangent...

Last month I went to an arcade and played through MK1 & 2 and remembered how much I love the early MK's and how much I HATE the controls... Since were talking about controls and tournament viability here, what do they allow in the "official" scene / tournaments? Is it shrugged upon to not use the cross setup? What do people typically use aside from that for MK games? I see Jassin using the vewlix style setup, just wondering how it feels. I may have to load it up in mame and give it a shot. Not sure how the community feels about anything other than the default controls.
We allow any controller types for MK since MAME doesn't allow for multiple inputs of the same direction at once, but with this potential new setup, that might eliminate keyboards. I haven't checked into that yet. There are still players who think tournaments should only be on cabinets on the original arcade controls, but that hasn't been realistic in at least 15 years, especially since XBLA 2006 UMK3. The MKII scene is pretty much just pad players and any OGs who show up they use whatever sticks we provide.
 
The MK sticks come with the same sticks and buttons as the original cabinet so not sure what the issue is there. Everything feels like the original cabinet to me. I couldn’t imagine playing on Japanese sticks with a weird layout. To each their own!

I am probably one of the people that thinks tournaments should be on original cabinets. It’s realistic if someone buys a cabinet. Understandable if nobody wants to do that. I do have the luxury of having several arcades with UMK3 cabinets and a fighting scene but that can’t happen everywhere.
 
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The MK sticks come with the same sticks and buttons as the original cabinet so not sure what the issue is there. Everything feels like the original cabinet to me. I couldn’t imagine playing on Japanese sticks with a weird layout. To each their own!
Yeah I have to play on Happ parts, and preferably a hard spring, but there are different grade parts, cherry switches and what not, and the PDP sticks are not standard. They aren't bad though.
 
Do you have a microswitch preference? Just popped open one of my MK sticks and looks like it has iL sticks and buttons with cherry microswitches but I have some D44X microswitches I might use in there. Just curious what others are using.
 
Do you have a microswitch preference? Just popped open one of my MK sticks and looks like it has iL sticks and buttons with cherry microswitches but I have some D44X microswitches I might use in there. Just curious what others are using.
I have heard most commonly that D44X are preferred over iL and that people were disappointed with the iL parts. It really only matters to stingy players I think, but if you have em, use em.
 
Nothing against Undamned, I love his products but I think if you are already dealing with lag from a LCD panel...
Why risking adding anymore? It's simply not worth it, esp when it can be so easily avoided with a new harness.
There is no lag from Undamned converters. The man is here, ask him yourself if you don't want my word, but there's nothing to worry about on that front.
 
Above ^ @Aurich that's what I was really saying... Some of the stick encoders have some lag in them, even if Undamned has zero its introducing lag to a system that otherwise (if direct wire DB15 supergun standard) has none.
 
Just want to pop in and say @UMKShock I'm a fan of your MK work and old videos. Pretty sure I never met you before I moved west but we ran in similar FGC circles in NJ back in the day. Gonna keep an eye on the progress of this project, as this game is one I'd like to eventually highlight as part of a local retro FGC event series I contribute to. I have UMK3 and MK2 boards so this is definitely of interest to me.

With regards to the PDP MK sticks, I'm happy to say the X360 version works well with the Undamned USB decoders. Buttons do not map correctly immediately upon connection and unfortunately the default mapping includes the small buttons and not all of the standard face buttons. Unless you decide to rewire away from those small buttons directly in the stick you will need to perform the UD USB decoder remap with the following sequence of button presses: HP BL HK LP LK RUN.

Also I wasn't aware the gaps between buttons on these sticks don't line up with the arcade control panel. I don't have an MK cab to compare against, was always under the impression that the layout is accurate. What I can confirm are the OEM parts on these sticks are definitely not the authentic stuff you'll find on a real cabinet. I swapped out the stick, buttons and switches soon as I got both of my sticks back in the day and never looked back.
 
From what I am reading the original arcade cabinets came with Happ competition joysticks which at the time were made by iL and most similar to the current iL Eurostick. The buttons were Happ competition with cherry microswitches.

What I’m also reading is that the PDP sticks came with the new Chinese Happ competition joysticks which are not as good and the buttons had e-switch micrososwitches which are garbage apparently. The Klassic supposedly came with cherry microswitches.

I have a TE and Klassic and the Klassic has iL buttons with cherry microswitches. Possible someone swapped out buttons at some point since I got it second hand.

My TE appears to be untouched and has Happ buttons with e-switches and the Chinese Happ competition stick.

I can see that the spacing between the joystick and buttons on the PDP are visibly farther away from the buttons but now I’m curious now if the button layout spacing is accurate to the arcade.
 
Nothing against Undamned, I love his products but I think if you are already dealing with lag from a LCD panel...
Why risking adding anymore? It's simply not worth it, esp when it can be so easily avoided with a new harness.
There is no lag from Undamned converters. The man is here, ask him yourself if you don't want my word, but there's nothing to worry about on that front.
Not to be nit picky but I remember reading undamned converters have 1 ms of lag from undamned himself. Pretty much nonexistent though. I wouldn't worry about it since the versatility is too good to pass up.

What can make a difference in the lag though is ultimately the stick/controller/peripheral you connect to it.Some sticks/firmwares on some of these arcade sticks can be quite laggy if tests are to be believed.

UD-USB Decoders
 
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Above ^ @Aurich that's what I was really saying... Some of the stick encoders have some lag in them, even if Undamned has zero its introducing lag to a system that otherwise (if direct wire DB15 supergun standard) has none.
Yeah, again I will definitely have mods done to my existing sticks and a couple pads so that there is a direct wired option available for our events, I believe I have mods on a couple sticks already that would allow for a very easy wiring job. This will make a lot of people happy.
Just want to pop in and say @UMKShock I'm a fan of your MK work and old videos. Pretty sure I never met you before I moved west but we ran in similar FGC circles in NJ back in the day. Gonna keep an eye on the progress of this project, as this game is one I'd like to eventually highlight as part of a local retro FGC event series I contribute to. I have UMK3 and MK2 boards so this is definitely of interest to me.

With regards to the PDP MK sticks, I'm happy to say the X360 version works well with the Undamned USB decoders. Buttons do not map correctly immediately upon connection and unfortunately the default mapping includes the small buttons and not all of the standard face buttons. Unless you decide to rewire away from those small buttons directly in the stick you will need to perform the UD USB decoder remap with the following sequence of button presses: HP BL HK LP LK RUN.

Also I wasn't aware the gaps between buttons on these sticks don't line up with the arcade control panel. I don't have an MK cab to compare against, was always under the impression that the layout is accurate. What I can confirm are the OEM parts on these sticks are definitely not the authentic stuff you'll find on a real cabinet. I swapped out the stick, buttons and switches soon as I got both of my sticks back in the day and never looked back.
Thanks man! Always great to hear this. I will have Cruz from BVG post some pics of the progress. I'm thinking if I have something for NEC in a couple weeks, it will not be complete in terms of presentation but we'll try it.

The gap between the buttons and stick doesn't seem like something that would be too annoying, but apparently it is. Fortunately we have a bunch of sticks.
Not to be nit picky but I remember reading undamned converters have 1 ms of lag from undamned himself. Pretty much nonexistent though. I wouldn't worry about it since the versatility is too good to pass up.
What can make a difference in the lag though is ultimately the stick/controller/peripheral you connect to it.Some sticks/firmwares on some of these arcade sticks can be quite laggy if tests are to be believed.

UD-USB Decoders
Yeah I'm not worried about ms of lag at this point, it's the frames. I think mame, PC, USB, etc, all adds up to several frames of lag. I even run and verify with a USB polling rate program on any setups I use for mame to make sure they are at 1000 Hz. I think a frame is like 15-20ms. I know all the numbers for specs of monitors and what not don't add up exactly, and 2ms could really mean 8ms, but I think eliminating mame would remove up to 50ms and the input drops/random spikes/driver conflicts.

Here's a pic from a convention a couple years ago with some of my sticks hanging around.

21414712_10154893294787014_9166143468827818764_o.jpg
21457316_10154893293797014_2854833185105252451_o.jpg
 
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Regular mame does have a lot of input lag. You ever use Groovymame? It cuts down a lot of the lag (same as disabling vsync on regular mame minus the screen tearing iirc) and even has a feature called frame delay to further reduce lag. I use it pretty exclusively vs mame.
 
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