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Conversion of single layer Taito Cup Finals PCB to something else?

Looks like I spoke too soon. The first play through is fine but if you die and start over the sound messes up, the speech is too quiet and the music stalls or repeats.

I thought maybe it was the gal I used as it was slower than the original pal (250ns vs 150ns) but even erasing and reusing the original pal chip it still does the same thing.

I noticed original boards have the two bodge wires shown in the conversion guide but also have an additional two, I'm thinking maybe these are needed. If I can figure out where the wires go from the low res pictures I've found I'll try it and report back.
 
Ace` said:
Looks like I spoke too soon. The first play through is fine but if you die and start over the sound messes up, the speech is too quiet and the music stalls or repeats.

I thought maybe it was the gal I used as it was slower than the original pal (250ns vs 150ns) but even erasing and reusing the original pal chip it still does the same thing.

I noticed original boards have the two bodge wires shown in the conversion guide but also have an additional two, I'm thinking maybe these are needed. If I can figure out where the wires go from the low res pictures I've found I'll try it and report back.
Click to expand...
Damn that sucks! Sounds like a code error and not a rom banking issue? (sound "code roms" speed maybe?)
Maybe it's fucking up on the 93c 8 pin eeprom? save some settings / factory clear?

Maybe reburn football and see if it has errors, it's easy to mess a line up on those taito boards.
 
The sound roms are fast, you can't really get slow 27c2001s and the eeprom got rewritten after the first boot.

I really think it's a case of a missing bodge wire or two as the ones on the original board are in the sound circuit too. I'll check what you suggested though, would be good if anyone else could report their findings that have done the conversion.
 
Looking at it again the wires make sense that it needs adding, the dual port S ram would cause the code to spazz out if corrupted / not clear.
Fail rate on that chip is quite bad too.... (fuji)
 
Ace` said:
mypinballs said:
D29-14 file attached in GAL22V10 form

Tested the file on a new chip in my board and works fine
Click to expand...
I finally got around to trying the Gunlock / Ray force conversion today, everything worked fine apart from the sound. I made the mistake of thinking the above file was IC14 converted to 22v10. After downloading the IC14 jed from jammarcade and sticking it on a gal20v8 (not palce20v8) it works 100%. :)
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The file is for use with a gal22v10 and works fine otherwise I wouldn’t have shared it.

not exierienced any sound issues here when I was testing it . Are you sure your board doesn’t have some other issue?
 
Couldn't get the 22v10 jed to work, tried various chips new and old.

It's possible there's another issue, it's not like I played it much when it was football. :) Have you tried dying on the first stage, letting the time run out and then started a new game? that's when the music / speech messes up. Powering off or going in and out of test will fix it for the first round.
 
The 2nd mod switches the RAS line from the ensoniq to processor controlled.

s-ram ras comes from pin 3 ic5 to pin 1 s ram

s ram line cut from ensoniq RAS output



The 3rd mod (PAL wire) not sure. PAL is different in pics than on cupfinals.

I dug my cupfinal board out... it has no sound to begin DOH!!!
 
I just tried the second mod, made zero difference. That just leaves the PAL mod, which is tricky as the layout is different.
 
Thanks for this awsome conversion tutorial :thumbsup:
I'm trying the Gunlock / Ray force conversion but after all steps I'm stuck on "color ram error"
It looks similar to Taito F3. Get your cart here
All traces looks well - donor board worked fine too...
Thanks in advance for any help.
 
If you get past the colour ram issue I'd be interested to hear if you have any speech / music issues. I've converted two pcbs to ray force now and both have quiet speech and crashing / repeating music when you die and start another game.
 
Thanks @Darksoft - but how to do it? I coudnt go to service menu via test button and do a memory clear...
OK @Ace`- let you know when I'll pass ram issue
 
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Ace` said:
If you get past the colour ram issue I'd be interested to hear if you have any speech / music issues. I've converted two pcbs to ray force now and both have quiet speech and crashing / repeating music when you die and start another game.
Click to expand...
Had the same issue with the sound. Using the jed file from jammarcade fixed it for me. Don't use the mame file. https://www.jammarcade.net/wiki/index.php?title=Ray_Force
You want the IC14 file. I used a PALCE20V8.
 
nnap can you tell me what type / speed PALCE20V8 you used? I used the original one from the board and the jed from jammarcade.net and still have the issues.
 
I used a AMD PALCE20V8H-15. So same spec as the original.
Just did a quick test and reprogrammed the orignal D29-13 chip and that works too. So you should be fine with that one.
I also did the wire mod (jumper from IC10 & IC23 Pin30 to 68k Pin46) as described by mypinballs and have not touched the JP1
 
I've done the wire mods and using the correct jed, I don't know what's causing it. What programmer did you use to program the PAL?
 
I use a Xeltek Superpro 610p. I can sen you a tested PAL if you like.
 
That would be great to rule it out completely. I'll send you a pm thanks.
 
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