Capcom Q-Sound amp help?

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    • hardyhell wrote:

      So you say I need to make that device chain
      Mvs - high low - amp - speakers
      That is the sequence, yes.

      hardyhell wrote:

      Is this amp good as welll or is ther a problem
      No difference in quality from the TDAxxxx amps. Also, I am willing to bet if you open up a Lepy amp, you'll find the same IC's in it. So what you don't gain or lose in quality, you gain in aesthetics and slight flexibility; aside from looking better, I think Lepy amps have dual speaker outputs or inputs (one or the other or both).

      Point is in this discussion is to save your money. No need for the Q-sound amp for your needs. The TDAxxxx amp is a good baseline for your needs. The Lepy amp is on equal footing with the TDAxxxx amp; can't lose or over do it with either.

      The post was edited 1 time, last by acblunden2 ().

    • Thanks @acblunden2
      I ordered the one I posted.

      By the way the stereo mvs boards have two stereo connectors. One says speakers and one says headphones. The speakers is very loud and high amped. Today I just tried the speaker connection directly to the NAC speakers. It’s very good levelled.
      Are there any problems coming towards me when I use this connector?

      For the seibu and the cps 2 perhaps also I would need the low first I guess
    • l_oliveira wrote:

      Thanks for confirming that. I thought that the first SIP chip would be a QSOUND processor. (analog, not digital)

      So if it's indeed just an amp (but a high quality one) then it doesn't really need to be the Capcom one on your cab.
      Hello my friend Oliveira, are you still active in this forum my friend?
      You help me out back in the psx-scene foruns with my SCPH-10000 PS2 to boot some software in it without any modification.

      It is not just an amp my friend, that is the key to unlock QSound information encoded inside the sound, without the amp, there is no Qsound effects my friend.

      The key factor to make QSound works is the perfect speaker/time alignment without it, you can't hear it. QSound has nothing to do with "Surround Sound" as we know it, when done correctly QSound makes you feel like you are inside a void is hard to describe but it is very similar when you use that sound canceling headphones, you turn it on but with no music, kind of like that.

      When you play the SF series, specially the SFA2, you get an immersive effect, looks like you are inside the game play stage, you listen to sound depth you can 't hear otherwise, can't describe with words.

      I have some decoded QSound samples, play in any smart tv (remember, the speakers has to be time aligned, any smart tv this days has it), while the video is playing, stay near the center of your screen (like an arcade) and play with the audio modes of your TV until you hear the depth field.



      It doesn't work with the smartphone speakers or headphones.
      Friends don't let friends play MAME
    • QSOUND works by phasing and reversing the waveforms being sent to each speaker so they cancel each other in the air. That way the DSP can control the sensation of proximity the listener has. Because of that, as you said it won't work with speakers which are not positioned correctly.

      Obviously it won't work with headphones lol.
    • l_oliveira wrote:

      QSOUND works by phasing and reversing the waveforms being sent to each speaker so they cancel each other in the air. That way the DSP can control the sensation of proximity the listener has. Because of that, as you said it won't work with speakers which are not positioned correctly.

      Obviously it won't work with headphones lol.
      LOL, tech questions are the best way to summon you.

      RIIIIIISE FROM YOUR GRAAAAAAVE.
    • Long time no see my friend!

      Yes!
      Technically QSound is based on a constructive/destructive wave interference plus time and phase alignment for the speakers.[1][2]
      The reason it failed was because the environment was too noisy, the players were never aligned with the speakers so they never experienced the 3D depth effects, to this day people don't know what QSound was all about, they never experienced.

      To my surprise people trash the Capcom amp away to replace it with something else, they don't have a clue that this amp is the most important piece for CPS2 QSound system, crazy!!! lol

      I've developed a sound processor in my back yard (literally) it has no relation with QSound but it can be tricked to decode QSound matrix.
      Friends don't let friends play MAME

      The post was edited 2 times, last by wuemura ().

    • nem wrote:

      wuemura wrote:

      To my surprise people trash the Capcom amp away to replace it with something else, they don't have a clue that this amp is the most important piece for CPS2 QSound system, crazy!!! lol
      So what makes the Capcom amp special? I thought we already agreed it's just an amp.
      It is not "just" an amp, the amp is the QSound decoder.
      The decoder takes the stereo QSound matrix and does this:


      Regular amp's doesn't decode this information, also, this is why even if you do any work in the QSound engine in emulation (superctr and ValleyBell did a really great job!) people won't hear the difference without the decoding stage. But people can hear the difference (thanks to superctr and ValleyBell) if when they release the vgmplay with the new QSound engine and connect the emulator audio output to a Qsound Amplifier.

      Then people will hear the magic happen.
      Friends don't let friends play MAME

      The post was edited 1 time, last by wuemura ().

    • l_oliveira wrote:

      SuperCTR and ValleyBell are the heroes of sound emulation. I see them often on the IRC and have plenty of pleasant conversations with them about sound stuff. SuperCTR is also the local specialist on NAMCO sound engines and music hardware. Thanks for pointing out the road for the proper sound on this systems.
      Yes they are SUPER heroes, true masters on what they do!
      Both of them are very decent and friendly people.

      nem wrote:

      wuemura wrote:

      It is not "just" an amp, the amp is the QSound decoder.
      What part of the amp is doing the decoding? Does it have some bespoke chips on it?

      l_oliveira wrote:

      I suppose the "decoding" is just some analog equalization thing.
      The part that does the magic are the opamps, they amplify the signal and does a matrix decoding.
      All people have to do is to find a schematic from that Capcom amplifier ans see how the opamps are configured.
      Friends don't let friends play MAME
    • hhmm only a page back @Frank_fjs mentioned that the decoding is done on the CPS2 hardware itself?

      Looking at an image of one of these amps there appears to be nothing custom or unique on them just some NEC opamps? if those are the key to 'decoding' the audio could you not make a standalone decoder board with those and pass line level audio through that to any old stereo amp?
    • tiff_lee wrote:

      hhmm only a page back @Frank_fjs mentioned that the decoding is done on the CPS2 hardware itself?

      Looking at an image of one of these amps there appears to be nothing custom or unique on them just some NEC opamps? if those are the key to 'decoding' the audio could you not make a standalone decoder board with those and pass line level audio through that to any old stereo amp?
      The secret is hidden in plain site, only a hand full knows about it, me included ;)
      CPS2 hardware has no decoding software or hardware, the DL-1425 CAPCOM-Q1 it is not a DSP, it's a "sophisticated" mixer. QSound technology is filter based, as Oliveira said, it rely on equalization of the signals outside the CPS2 board that also mess with phase shifts to create the desired effect. Oliveira talk about the effect of sound waves canceling each other out in middle air, here an example.

      Download this file, play it with any stereo equipment THAT HAS SPEAKERS, it doesn't work with headphones, it might work with smartphones IF they have stereo speakers, you can use your SMART TV but you have to turn the sound enhancements off. You should hear a whistle (it doesn't need to be loud), slowly walk around the space you are at and you'll notice that in some areas the sound is louder (constructive interference) and in some places the sound it's gone or you can barely hear it (destructive interference), that is sound waves canceling each other out in the middle of the air in real time and this is the principle QSound uses to trick your mind.

      About the hardware, take a closer look again and ask yourself this, why it needs 6 operational amplifiers (two per chip) to amplify a stereo sound and why there is so much polyester caps on that board? Polyester caps and opamps, why they are used for? Frequency filtering, phase shift. I don't have the hardware but to me the opamp closer to the RCA socket is doing some summing and differential work (this is de basic of audio matrix decoding), not to say if the cabinet uses some passive crossovers near the speaker.

      Yes it's possible to do a decoder and use it with another power amplifier, that would be fine if you use the same opamp configuration/filtering/matrix decoding.
      I've developed my own ASP (Analog Sound Processor) to do something else.


      It doesn't decode QSound but it can work something close to it, you can try this sample, the Ryu Stage from Super Street Fighter, same rules apply, it only works with Stereo Speakers and it doesn't work with headphones. You should notice a wider stereo and some taiko drums and hyōshigi (拍子木) in th distance, it works great with Smart Tv's, play with the sound enhancements until you notice some depth to it.
      Friends don't let friends play MAME
    • This is extremely interesting, and I think this is the first time I've seen all of this discussed.

      So, what happens if you just send a regular stereo audio signal through the Q-Sound amp? I planned to turn one into a stand-alone amplifier for all of my arcade gaming, but maybe that's not ideal if it's going to apply Q-Sound filtering to the source.
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