Cannon Dancer/Osman Conversion -> The FREE Edition once and for all (JoeMac/Magical Drop pcb)

[AlxUnderBase]

@AlxUnderBase

Swapbyte should be automatic by the programmer, don't you have that option in yours? I have two shitty chinese programmers (top3000 and tl866a) and both of them did not have that option, so what i usually do is load the file in my old willem sivava programmer PCB50 (here) and use his program to do the job (vers 0.97j)

Sadly , i didn't seen nothing about in my TOP3000 too , and i have on the way a TL866 Pro II . I've made manualy for Rolling Thunder 2, but maybe in the future i will meet another projects who will need byteswap for some files and i wanna learn . i installed HxD for hexfiles and i've done that , also i have WinHex installed

 

[Spaayse]

@AlxUnderBase

I also only have a TOP3000 available with no better alternative at the moment. Following so that I can learn as well because I'm pretty new to this stuff, but am super interested in this conversion.

 

[AlxUnderBase]

@AlxUnderBase

I also only have a TOP3000 available with no better alternative at the moment. Following so that I can learn as well because I'm pretty new to this stuff, but am super interested in this conversion.

the job must be done in a program who will read hex files like HxD or WinHex ... and done manualy , but when i've made first arcade order (CPS2 multi) i didn't know about the existence for any programmer . the Top3000 is a great programmer , do all you need for the conversion (write very well the eeproms needed for this purpose) , in rest we must learn .

 

[djsheep]

Thanks for sharing @TheDeath, I overpaid for a Osman conversion from Korea but do not regret it. It’s a truly insane game and the true sequel to Strider. The backstory on the game is a good read. https://strider.fandom.com/wiki/Kirin. Great the conversion info is public finally.

I anticipate these “common” games are not going to be priced with common sense anymore (Major Title 2 anyone?). I see Tops has already been cleaned out lol!

 

[TheDeath]

@twistedsymphony I just found out that i didn't had the OKi fix haha
Just to be clear and finally close this, do i need to cut the trace to pin 7 for the SS Sampling Freq and give it a low ground instead of a high? What about the upper oki?

Edit: oh ok, it's pin 5 for the clock in, i suppose. But i don't know where to fill it

 

[AlxUnderBase]

@twistedsymphony I just found out that i didn't had the OKi fix haha
Just to be clear and finally close this, do i need to cut the trace to pin 7 for the SS Sampling Freq and give it a low ground instead of a high? What about the upper oki?

Edit: oh ok, it's pin 5 for the clock in, i suppose. But i don't know where to fill it

this ?

 

[TheDeath]

@twistedsymphony I just found out that i didn't had the OKi fix haha
Just to be clear and finally close this, do i need to cut the trace to pin 7 for the SS Sampling Freq and give it a low ground instead of a high? What about the upper oki?

Edit: oh ok, it's pin 5 for the clock in, i suppose. But i don't know where to fill it

this ?

Oh, thanks! It's pin 8 or 9? XD it's not clear for me

 

[AlxUnderBase]

Pin 9 from the ic to pin 5 on the smd chip

 

[twistedsymphony]

@twistedsymphony I just found out that i didn't had the OKi fix haha
Just to be clear and finally close this, do i need to cut the trace to pin 7 for the SS Sampling Freq and give it a low ground instead of a high? What about the upper oki?

Edit: oh ok, it's pin 5 for the clock in, i suppose. But i don't know where to fill it

pin 5 of the J13 OKI goes straight up, you'll see a via and it will keep going, you need to cut it between that via and the chip. then connect it to pin 5 of the other OKI. alternatively I tied it to pin 9 of the logic IC at H10 which also happens to go to pin 5 of the other OKI

 

[TheDeath]

@twistedsymphony I just found out that i didn't had the OKi fix haha
Just to be clear and finally close this, do i need to cut the trace to pin 7 for the SS Sampling Freq and give it a low ground instead of a high? What about the upper oki?

Edit: oh ok, it's pin 5 for the clock in, i suppose. But i don't know where to fill it

pin 5 of the J13 OKI goes straight up, you'll see a via and it will keep going, you need to cut it between that via and the chip. then connect it to pin 5 of the other OKI. alternatively I tied it to pin 9 of the logic IC at H10 which also happens to go to pin 5 of the other OKI

Thank you!

 

[Stupid Dufus]

I'm kind of interested in trying this with a MD board, but I've never done a conversion.

I have soldering skills and programmers (FlashCat and GQ-4x4, don't I think either can program a GAL).

Would this be a good one to start with? And if so, should I try to get a MD board sooner rather than later?

 

[TheDeath]

@twistedsymphony I did the clock patch but the music stops after few seconds, it cuts out while effects are still going, you can hear it cracking for a sec and then die. (cut trace between the first truhole and oki pin 5, then wired directly to upper oki, pin 5, that is connected to pin 9 of the 74ls74an)
Sometimes the board even reset itself and won't boot for a while. If i remove 13H 27c160 the game works till the end (with only effects).
the 27c160 is good, verify was ok and i even compared to the rom after a dump, its the same exact.
I have used a 27c020 for the 14H sound program, and also tryed a 4001 (double writed), since there is a difference on pin A18, won't make difference.
Also checked my solders, they are ok, no bridges
The hell is that? Board was working flawless with Charlie and Magical.

I've also realized that NONE of my programmed gals, exept for the ones already present at 4E and 8F (Magical Drop) will work. However the programmed 5C with osman will do.
I have tryed anything i could find related to PLD's, joe mac, gonta 2, charlie ninja.. none of them works on my board. I don't get it.
I have dumped 4E and 8F of this Magical Drop and i could not find a match in any of the other pals, but i honestly know nothing about them so it's just a guess for me.
These were also working with Charlie Ninja (i did not changed them at all) and they are marked WF-02 and WF-00, not WH

 

[twistedsymphony]

I did the clock patch but the music stops after few seconds, it cuts out while effects are still going.
Sometimes the board even reset itself and won't boot for a while. If i remove 13H 27c160 the game works till the end (with only effects).

I've played mine to the end without problem.

are you sure the trace cut is 100% and you didn't accidentally create a short when adding the wire.

 

[TheDeath]

I did the clock patch but the music stops after few seconds, it cuts out while effects are still going.
Sometimes the board even reset itself and won't boot for a while. If i remove 13H 27c160 the game works till the end (with only effects).

I've played mine to the end without problem.
are you sure the trace cut is 100% and you didn't accidentally create a short when adding the wire.

Yes, its the only thing i'm sure about haha
I've edited my previous post, does something make "sense" to you?

 

[jepjepjep]

Are there any differences between Osman and Cannon Dancer besides the title screen and dialog?

I've played the game a bunch, enough to 1cc both versions and there I haven't noticed any gameplay differences.

There is a dipswitch setting that seems to trigger a bug relating to the damage scaling that makes a big difference to gameplay. There's some discussion about it in this thread:
https://shmups.system11.org/viewtopic.php?p=1054842&sid=8b03a3dbac936a948f065847feff8c88#p1054842

This dip setting can't be changed in the service menu. You have to set it in the image that gets burned to the eeprom to modify it.

 

[twistedsymphony]

(cut trace between the first truhole and oki pin 5, then wired directly to upper oki, pin 5, that is connected to pin 9 of the 74ls74an)

can you show me a picture of which trace you cut? the "upper" OKI is different depending on how you have the PCB oriented).

I've also realized that NONE of my programmed gals, except for the ones already present at 4E and 8F (Magical Drop) will work. However the programmed 5C with osman will do.
I have tryed anything i could find related to PLD's, joe mac, gonta 2, charlie ninja.. none of them works on my board. I don't get it.

5C is the only PLD that needs to be changed, the others should work the same for all games, Factory uses a GAL16V8B-15LP as a replacement. I would recommend using a -15LP speed or faster GAL here.

 

[TheDeath]

(cut trace between the first truhole and oki pin 5, then wired directly to upper oki, pin 5, that is connected to pin 9 of the 74ls74an)

can you show me a picture of which trace you cut? the "upper" OKI is different depending on how you have the PCB oriented).

I've also realized that NONE of my programmed gals, except for the ones already present at 4E and 8F (Magical Drop) will work. However the programmed 5C with osman will do.
I have tryed anything i could find related to PLD's, joe mac, gonta 2, charlie ninja.. none of them works on my board. I don't get it.

5C is the only PLD that needs to be changed, the others should work the same for all games, Factory uses a GAL16V8B-15LP as a replacement. I would recommend using a -15LP speed or faster GAL here.

@twistedsymphony I've cutted here, underneath the cable.

I didn't programmed 4E and 8F at all, there are still the original ones from Magical Drop

 

[AlxUnderBase]

@TheDeath .. sir , did you solder on pin 6 instead pin 5 of that oki chip

 

[twistedsymphony]

that's the wrong pin, you've added a wire to pin 7 (or 7, I can't tell) not pin 5.

pin 1 is on the far left and pin 11 is on the far right

EDIT @AlxUnderBase beat me to it...

 

[TheDeath]

that's the wrong pin, you've added a wire to pin 7 (or 7, I can't tell) not pin 5.

pin 1 is on the far left and pin 11 is on the far right

EDIT @AlxUnderBase beat me to it...

Yeah, sorry, it was an older picture when i was trying to figure out by my self. this is how its now.
I posted that just for the cut (cable wasn't even connected)