Good Info. Can you please elaborate? Is that a good or bad thing? Do you foresee more cool things happening from the same person(s)?
- Thread starter DJLC
- Start date
nothing good nothing bad, just a fact/info.
also nothing cool expected, at least at interesting for me emulation/documentation part, because these "Moo" emulators uses code from MAME or/and other opensource projects like FBNeo.
also nothing cool expected, at least at interesting for me emulation/documentation part, because these "Moo" emulators uses code from MAME or/and other opensource projects like FBNeo.
fandangos
Student
Isn't this guy the one that did the translation?
https://twitter.com/necrosofty/status/1265472772928462849
I figured since he speaks about the history of the game he might have some involvement.
He also claims the translation was done in a period of a few days.
I saw this too, and I'm sure "Arcade emulator written from scratch,proprietary" part is not correct 
because I've RE'd SF30 emu too, and seen there A LOT of code copy&past-ed from MAME (or FinalBurn, which have copied from MAME too)
because I've RE'd SF30 emu too, and seen there A LOT of code copy&past-ed from MAME (or FinalBurn, which have copied from MAME too)
no idea who did the translation, I was more interested in emulator code research
fandangos
Student
Once bashed as piracy the MAME project paved the way for those collections to ever exist. So people can rebuy the same games.I saw this too, and I'm sure "Arcade emulator written from scratch,proprietary" part is not correct
because I've RE'd SF30 emu too, and seen there A LOT of code copy&past-ed from MAME (or FinalBurn, which have copied from MAME too)
Ironic, isn't it?
The hijacking part of that document probably is what we saw as 0xBBBB on the rom.
It would crash on real hardware but they mention a code that would be triggered whenever a crash would pop up and inject their code.
Luckily for us the .pbin file isn't part of the emulator executable and also it was not patched directly into the game's ROM.
I wonder if the devs already knew people would reverse the game, release the roms so they chose a way that we could have the original rom, and also we could have the translation for preservation purposes, just like MAME served for this purpose and this collection.
old_man_rukus
New User
There's no way they didnt see this coming. I think not only did they not see this coming, they went through seemingly trivial work to actually get it working. Moo also clearly isn't written from scratch, in fact I don't know too many that are written from scratch. I truthfully think SNK may take all the work done here, and make something official out of it, maybe an AES/MVS Cart officially working.Once bashed as piracy the MAME project paved the way for those collections to ever exist. So people can rebuy the same games.I saw this too, and I'm sure "Arcade emulator written from scratch,proprietary" part is not correct
because I've RE'd SF30 emu too, and seen there A LOT of code copy&past-ed from MAME (or FinalBurn, which have copied from MAME too)
Ironic, isn't it?
The hijacking part of that document probably is what we saw as 0xBBBB on the rom.
It would crash on real hardware but they mention a code that would be triggered whenever a crash would pop up and inject their code.
Luckily for us the .pbin file isn't part of the emulator executable and also it was not patched directly into the game's ROM.
I wonder if the devs already knew people would reverse the game, release the roms so they chose a way that we could have the original rom, and also we could have the translation for preservation purposes, just like MAME served for this purpose and this collection.
For Metallic, iirc, FB Alpha was the first emulator to emulate CPS2, while MAME had CPS1 games already working. I think they borrowed heavily from each other on that one. And then MOO took from that. I don't even know why anyone wouldn't want to borrow/steal from MAME/FBA source code at this point, why reinvent the wheel?
errrm, you probably not aware of CPS2 = CPS1 with encryption. basically its almost same thing feature-wise, but have added strong protection and uses faster CPU clocks.
if I not mistaken, no FB people was involved in CPS2 encryption hacking/research, so I don't know how and why you think "FBA was 1st to emulate CPS2".
also, if you'll look inside of FBA/FBN source code you'll see there (almost) all the main components borrowed from MAME (CPU cores, SPU cores, etc etc), so I no idea if FBA have anything MAME might borrow from there...
old_man_rukus
New User
Thank you for schooling me on this... I got this info from my (incorrect) assumption from the days when XOR tables would get released for CPS2 games, and remember waiting for FBA to support them lol, MAME wouldn't play them at the time
@Darksoft no, because most parts of nowdays MAME is under BSD-3.
except for Neo-Geo sound part, if this emulator uses Neo-Geo's Yamaha YM2610 emulation code from MAME (or FBA), which is licensed under GPL v3 - it is illegal.
it is also illegal to use in commercial projects any code borrowed from older pre-2016 MAME, which was under custom strict-non-commercial only license. and its also illegal to use pre-2016 MAME code In GPL-licensed projects as well (hi libretro/retroarch!)
except for Neo-Geo sound part, if this emulator uses Neo-Geo's Yamaha YM2610 emulation code from MAME (or FBA), which is licensed under GPL v3 - it is illegal.
it is also illegal to use in commercial projects any code borrowed from older pre-2016 MAME, which was under custom strict-non-commercial only license. and its also illegal to use pre-2016 MAME code In GPL-licensed projects as well (hi libretro/retroarch!)
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fandangos
Student
Correct me if I'm wrong but isn't reversing the game to find out those codes illegal?
I remember something like this being discussed when the PS3 got hacked and they found gimp code inside, which is under GPL.
So, if you can't reverse a software and use your findings are proof, how can you move forward with this legally?
@fandangos short answer - reverse engineering considered "fair use" in US and legal.
read more there - https://www.eff.org/issues/coders/reverse-engineering-faq
it may be or may not legal in other countries, each country laws may have it in one way or another.
read more there - https://www.eff.org/issues/coders/reverse-engineering-faq
it may be or may not legal in other countries, each country laws may have it in one way or another.
Atomik on NGS successfully run the original game with custom pcb on real AES hardware ! (with some code adjustments if i remember correctly), on other side active members on NGS completely finish the English translation and gfx mod, what a huge job ! Thanks to them !
best,
Nico
fandangos
Student
If I'm following it correctly the graphics replacement for Special to Perfect are not completely done, is it?
I see people talking about the translation but the GFX seems to still be a working in progress by elrayzeur
Yes, i think gfx parts not completely done. I will check it to confirm !
For credits,Elrayzeur done a big big job on the gfx, for trads, i was misread your post on NGS
who perform it ? you and ack isn’it ?
For credits,Elrayzeur done a big big job on the gfx, for trads, i was misread your post on NGS
who perform it ? you and ack isn’it ?
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You roxx guys !! Thanks to both of you.
Thanks for the huge work, trads is a pain sometimes !
With guys work’s on NGS, it’s now possible to bring something working great visually !
Keep the work !
Thanks
Nico
