Maybe we can get Tamashii running on there too!Seems white/black label is certainly possible as well:
https://page.auctions.yahoo.co.jp/jp/auction/o286457914
Waiting for my DDP DOJ to get here from @sheep_nova and we'll go from there
- Thread starter 98pacecar
- Start date
Tamashii is PGM2 only isn't it? I don't think you'll be back porting that to PGM1
oneleaf86
Grand Master
Revised labels in PDF format.
I've reduced the horizontal size which should make for a perfect fit.
Also revised the Ketsui label because as @SpudJones pointed out I had the last two characters reversed
I've reduced the horizontal size which should make for a perfect fit.
Also revised the Ketsui label because as @SpudJones pointed out I had the last two characters reversed
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That is my thinking, because as far as I can tell the graphics PCB is just a dumb ROM board, so ANY game should work with big enough ROMs. My plan (unless someone beats me to it, which would save me some work) is to just pick whatever ROM type is easiest to get.
If what other people report is true, that the ASIC/ARM cpu is just required to decrypt the ROM, it would be possible to make a ROM-only program PCB as well. That would required a decrypted + patched program ROM, though, and wouldn't work for titles that run gameplay on the ARM cpu.
Edit: Just checked the datasheet of the 27C322, which doesn't seem to have a byte mode, which means it can't be used for the M-ROM. Though obviously you could add a separate 8-bit ROM, or just not connect the upper byte of the 16-bits and sacrifice half the capacity.
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It is, but it's just a different arrange mode of the game. It's not a whole new game or anything. So maybe!
It has been hinted at some point
AFAIK 27C322 (32Mbit) is the largest DIP package EPROM you can get, but it's 16-bit only. the 27C160 (16Mbit) is the largest DIP package EPROM that will work in 8-bit mode.
I don't think there are any 8-bit ROMs on the graphics PCB for any of the games. most of the games actually use 64Mbit SMD EPROMs. On the Program PCB I don't think any of the games have an M-ROM large enough to need even a 27C160, most games don't even use it.
yes, his Killing Blade conversion had the ASIC, M-ROM and one of the PALs completely removed. It looks like the remaining PAL might be custom and we don't know if there are any jumper wires on the PCB either.
I was poking around the mame driver a bit today and there were a few things I noticed.
on the ketbl and espgalbl ROM maps I noticed this comment:
so I wonder if these ROMs are basically patched by appending the single board bios into the program ROM so it can overlay the cart system bios.
MAME uses DDP2 as the virtual cart that's being converted for this, but we've seen countless KOV2 carts converted using the same exact program ROM. Also the virtually converted DDP2 card and the real KOV2 cart conversions have their original, unmodified protection code in place. So either
1. both DDP2 and KOV2 use the same protection
or
2. something in the ketbl/espgalbl program roms disables the protection
or
3. something about the PAL modification disables the protection.
As for Killing Blade specifically... There's a significant difference in how the program ROM is loaded in ketbl/espgalbl vs KOV2 and killbld
kov2:
killbldp:
ketbl:
so the modifications to the pal on killing blade are probably the same as what needs to be done on KOV2.
I mean the ROM could have been formatted to not require these PAL modificaitons, I wonder if the ROM is setup the way it is to work around the protection.
4. someone decrypyted DDP2 and re-encoded it with the KOV2 key
5. maybe the ASIC can be configured to a pass-through mode for development?
I agree about the BIOS being appended.
I attached a new version of the schematic, which includes both the program and graphics board. I traced J1 of the program board to the motherboard, so A1-A23 and D0-D15 are the M68k CPU signals, though I didn't trace them to the ASIC. The various control signals are probably going through some glue logic, which is why they didn't show up on the connector. (Though thinking about it I could probably check against the BIOS chip what is probably R/W, CS or OE, but I already put the red cover back on...)
5. maybe the ASIC can be configured to a pass-through mode for development?
I agree about the BIOS being appended.
I attached a new version of the schematic, which includes both the program and graphics board. I traced J1 of the program board to the motherboard, so A1-A23 and D0-D15 are the M68k CPU signals, though I didn't trace them to the ASIC. The various control signals are probably going through some glue logic, which is why they didn't show up on the connector. (Though thinking about it I could probably check against the BIOS chip what is probably R/W, CS or OE, but I already put the red cover back on...)
no, DDP2 only exists as the officially released version; there is no "bootleg"/modified version.
maybe it can, but in this case no, because in all existing scenarios it remains unmodified.
Nice progress. I'm interested to see where this ends up.
when I was going over the MAME driver earlier I also looked at how many ROMs were needed for the various games. while they're all pretty consistantly sized on the program board. if you plan to go with DIP sized ROMs on the Graphics board you wont be able to support any of the beat-em ups, fighting games or Demon Front, they just have so much graphic/sound data that you wouldn't be able to physically fit the chips on the board without going SMD. you could definitely make one that supports all of the SHMUPS though, you'd be looking at 7 total 27c322s, 1 for sound, 4 for sprite color data, and 2 for sprite mask data. the puzzle game use even less data so those would be covered too.
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kazuo
Grand Master
If I didn't get the feeling that'll sell for over $1000USD, and if not for the fact that I don't want to give Scramble any money, I'd say we should buy it and dump it.Seems white/black label is certainly possible as well:
https://page.auctions.yahoo.co.jp/jp/auction/o286457914
Waiting for my DDP DOJ to get here from @sheep_nova and we'll go from there
I guess I will look for DIP sized ROMs at the start, as I'm mostly interested in the games that have no official release. SMD sized packages are a pain to solder and program.
Though I'm sure someone can make an SMD variant once everything is documented.One problem is that most of the larger DIP sized types are listed as obsolete, so you probably get only new old stock... or maybe make DIP sized prosthetics for SMD roms?
TODO: Graphics: I'm planning to verify the M-ROM connections against the datasheet of the sound chip, and I have to verify chip selection and WTF is going on with the higher two address lines of the A-ROMs. Program: Trace the remaining PAL and ROM connections and the connections to the ASIC. (Sigh.)
If you mean "no official cart release" then there are 3
-Do Don Pachi Dai Ou Jou
-Espgaluda
-Ketsui
all 3 of those would use
1x 27c322 program ROM on program PCB
2x 27c322 text/background ROM on program PCB
1x 27c322 audio ROMs on graphics PCB
4x 27c322 sprite color ROMs on graphics PCB
2x 27c322 sprite mask ROMs on graphics PCB
So far all of the conversion carts use ASICS with an internal ROM only, so no need for the small external ROM
If you're going to move forward with this I'd develop the graphics PCB first. it should only need the 7 27c322 ICs, some caps and a couple of logic ICs and it will be the same for all 3 games.
The Program PCB will be more challenging since we don't yet know
1. how to make the games run without the ASIC
2. what exactly the PALs are doing
3. what's different about DDODOJ and the other two games that makes them need a different program board.
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If I understand this conversion correctly then my schematic of the char board should cover the relevant details. I'll need one 74ls139 to decode M and B ROMs, and one half of another 74ls139 to decode A ROMs. The other half of the 74ls139 and the AND gate are required to decode U7 and U9, which are not replaced in that mod.
I'm not sure if the 27c322 for the audio rom will work, as the mod uses a MX29L3211 which has a 4Mx8 mode while the 27c322 is 2Mx16. Though it'll be fine if only half the audio data is used...
I'm not sure if the 27c322 for the audio rom will work, as the mod uses a MX29L3211 which has a 4Mx8 mode while the 27c322 is 2Mx16. Though it'll be fine if only half the audio data is used...
That same conversion can also be done on this cart: Any PGM Conversion info out there?
which uses a 27c322 for the audio rom from the factory.
this is a newer revision of the KOVSH cart and as I said many times in this thread, this is the best template for creating a custom cart, particularly the graphics board.
I've done the conversion on one of these carts myself and it works perfectly.
