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So I was looking at the 246/256 software list and was hoping to gain some clarification as to what I need to purchase to end up with what I'm after.

Games I'm interested in:
Capcom Fighting Jam
idolmaster (I know this needs a touch-screen, anything else required in addition to that? Special I/O or anything?)
Kinnikuman
Soul Calibur III
Taiko no Tatsujin (all 246/256 titles)
Technic Beat

From my understanding all of these titles will work on a 256.

Do I need any kind of special I/O for standard stick and button games, or is the 256 plug and play with the Taito JVS I/O found in the Vewlix F, or the Sega JVS I/O in a New Net City?

Does any game require a special I/O? I know that idolmaster needs a touchscreen, and I'd read that Taiko no Tatsujin can be adapted to using buttons until I can find a suitable cabinet.

Am I missing anything?
 
system is fully JVS compliant. I use to use my sega jvs io from my Naomi but now use my capcom io just for convenience. Some games only run on the 256 such as Tekken 5 but many games originally for 246 will run on 256. There is a compatibility list out there I have seen but can't find it now. I'm not familiar with some of the special games you listed but most games don't need anything special. I have my campcom kick harness plugged in from my capcom io to supergun. I power the 246/256 with an adapter that plugs in to my Naomi sun psu.
 
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IF you are playing stick and buton games Sega I/O will work fine. Most racing and gun games require special I/Os and will not work without them.
 
Thank you both!

Coyo, I'll have to see if I can rig up a similar adapter down the line for the Sun PSU. I still need to come across a 256 for sale domestically first, I suppose. Past eBay auctions suggest they're very reasonable, there just aren't any for sale right now without a game I'm not interested in.

Mitsurugi, I guess I need to find out if idolmaster or Taiko need specific I/O's. I would assume that idolmaster must as something has to interpret the touchscreen inputs.

I know that TnT runs off of 4 analog sensors per drum. I'm just unsure of how they find their way from drum to the 256 itself. If I could find a manual I'd have part numbers and could be better informed from there. There's a gent on bemaniso who converted it to a digital signal and uses push-buttons. Figure I could do the same then wire it up to a pad-hacked wii-mote drum controller whilst saving up for the real cab.
 
Defor is the man to talk to. He is one of the authorities on 246/256 and he has modded some PS2 drums to work with Taiko also.
 
Defor is the man to talk to. He is one of the authorities on 246/256 and he has modded some PS2 drums to work with Taiko also.
Yeah, Defor was working on an adapter that you could hook up a console Taiko drum to the 246/256, but there hasn't been any progress on it yet. (I'm dying to get my hands on one, myself.)
I'll say this right now, though... Taiko no Tatsujin 7/8/9/10 are somewhat common to see, but any of the later ones are downright impossible. They're that rare.



Idolmaster... I saw this up for auction once and really regret not bidding on it as it's not dumped (to my knowledge). But yeah, it's totally unplayable without a touch screen set-up.


Technic Beat... this is a fairly rare game, but a fun one (once you learn how to play it). It doesn't need anything special to play it, just the joystick and buttons. I'd suggest tracking down a cheap copy of the PS2 port.
 
Defor is the man to talk to. He is one of the authorities on 246/256 and he has modded some PS2 drums to work with Taiko also.
Yeah, Defor was working on an adapter that you could hook up a console Taiko drum to the 246/256, but there hasn't been any progress on it yet. (I'm dying to get my hands on one, myself.)
I'll say this right now, though... Taiko no Tatsujin 7/8/9/10 are somewhat common to see, but any of the later ones are downright impossible. They're that rare.



Idolmaster... I saw this up for auction once and really regret not bidding on it as it's not dumped (to my knowledge). But yeah, it's totally unplayable without a touch screen set-up.


Technic Beat... this is a fairly rare game, but a fun one (once you learn how to play it). It doesn't need anything special to play it, just the joystick and buttons. I'd suggest tracking down a cheap copy of the PS2 port.
I have Technic Beat on PS2! I'm just super curious how different the port is from the original :).

I've seen Idolmaster up for auction two or three times since I learned about it (though one included the whole cabinet). If it pops up again I'll be sure to bid on it.

I missed out on 3 Taiko titles this past week on auction. I think it was 2 copies of 8, and a copy of 10? In any case, I intend to use the WiiU pro controller until I can either source the actual arcade drum controller, or save up for the cab. At least the pro controller is closer to full size.
There's a gentleman on ArcadeOtaku who posted back in July that if anyone needed help with CHD's of any of the TnT titles he'd be willing to help out. Shot him a PM since he has 7-14+ except 14 (or maybe it was 12+ he doesn't have) and a bunch of those haven't been dumped yet.

I find it odd that there are so many cracks and workarounds for Beatmania/Pop'n/Insert Random Dance Game Name/etc so you can play the real thing on your PC, as well as big fancy arcade-quality controller manufacturers like djdao, but Taiko somehow never got that following.

And mitsurugi, thanks for the tip, I'll send him some questions about the I/O's.
 
Technic Beat plays basically the same. I recall it was a fairly faithful port. Just hook up an arcade-style joystick/buttons to your PS2 and you should be able to replicate the experience of how it plays in a cab. Fun game, but it's only expensive because it's rare. If the 246/256 multi-dongle ever gets made, it'll make playing the arcade version a snap.


Keep me posted if you hear anything about the Taiko adapter. (Or the in-progress 246/256 multi-dongle.)
 
I think most of the games u want to play work on the 246. It's an easier system to find. I ended up w 2 and only use my 256 for tekken 5. Wish I could find that compatibility list again.
 
I think most of the games u want to play work on the 246. It's an easier system to find. I ended up w 2 and only use my 256 for tekken 5. Wish I could find that compatibility list again.
I've gotten my 256 to run everything I've tried to run in it except Tekken 4 and Taiko 7. So it's definitely the system to get, if you're willing to import one. I also like the 256 because it's smaller.

Game list: http://wiki.arcadeotaku.com/w/Namco_System_246/256#Games
 
I think most of the games u want to play work on the 246. It's an easier system to find. I ended up w 2 and only use my 256 for tekken 5. Wish I could find that compatibility list again.
246 won't run Taiko 9-14, so it's not even an option for me. Both Kinnikuman games state 256-only as well. At least according to the compatibility list aoiddr linked.

I think most of the games u want to play work on the 246. It's an easier system to find. I ended up w 2 and only use my 256 for tekken 5. Wish I could find that compatibility list again.
I've gotten my 256 to run everything I've tried to run in it except Tekken 4 and Taiko 7. So it's definitely the system to get, if you're willing to import one. I also like the 256 because it's smaller.

Game list: http://wiki.arcadeotaku.com/w/Namco_System_246/256#Games
If I don't find one by the new year I'll likely import one. There are a ton up on YAJ at the moment pretty cheap, but I'm always wary of whether or not PCB's work. Sometimes google translating makes sense, other times the results are cryptic... This time they're cryptic :(.
 
Further info I found elsewhere regarding Taiko. Placing it here in case someone weeks/months/years from now searches for it.

Taiko is very forgiving and will load regardless of the IO that's attached to the system.

The official namco jamma IO that Tekken uses does not work.

The Sega naomi jamma IO does work. I believe Taiko expects a USB IO device.

The drums are analog... sort of. All 8 drum inputs are mapped to the IO's 8 analog inputs. I was able to manipulate the drums with microswitches, attaching the analog input to the common terminal, along with VCC to NO and GND to NC. Unfortunately, this is not a good solution because there's a chance of shorting ground to VCC, which shuts down the IO.
I still find it odd that it's so difficult to find a manual on-line for this.
 
aoiddr - I found pictures of the IO that sits between the drums and the JVS IO. Or perhaps it's the only IO in a TnT cab? It's too bad the pictures aren't a TAD clearer so I could get a model number on the PCB.

http://imgur.com/a/Blcjd

The next time a set like this shows up on YAJ, I'm buying it, hell or high water, and then looking into how to bring TnT to the digital signal masses...

Also, this may be a stupid question, but have you tried wiring up a PS2 controller and booting TnT that way?
 
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aoiddr - I found pictures of the IO that sits between the drums and the JVS IO. Or perhaps it's the only IO in a TnT cab? It's too bad the pictures aren't a TAD clearer so I could get a model number on the PCB.

http://imgur.com/a/Blcjd

The next time a set like this shows up on YAJ, I'm buying it, hell or high water, and then looking into how to bring TnT to the digital signal masses...

Also, this may be a stupid question, but have you tried wiring up a PS2 controller and booting TnT that way?

I haven't tried wiring up a PS2 controller, but I did try wiring up 4 microswitch-based arcade buttons (the microswitches with the 3 prongs). The problem with JVC wiring is that if you do it wrong, you can end up easily grounding out your i/o boards if you have the +5V and GND lines crossing. Once I got past that miswiring, my results still weren't promising as while I could start the game and make drum hits, it was full of button misfires that rendered the game unplayable. I know a bit more about JVS wiring now, but it can still be a bit of a confusing mess without a game pinout diagram or manual. I know it's totally possible to getting it working with buttons...and then actual drums, but it's a bit beyond me at this point without a lot of trial and error.
 
Gotcha. I figured maybe since the PS2 controller's native to the 256 and you wouldn't need to go through any sort of IO it might work that way.

Found a 256, as well as a few cheap Gundam games. Only a few steps away from testing stuff myself! :D

Oh, I also found an Idolmaster I/O. No idea where I'd find a compatible touchscreen, but one step at a time I guess?
 
I think Defor could shed some light here...He's the 246/256 man.
 
Sorry, been working on finishing up the groundwork for opening the 246/256 to some more usability and haven't had time to pop in recently-
Hoping to get a proper thread up soon with the details of what's going on on my side when things have calmed down.

Anyway- looking through the questions:

- System 256 imho is a better platform as far as compatibility goes- as only a small number of early games for the 246 won't run on it- although many are "iconic" to the system: RRV, BR3, Tekken4...

- As far as the PS2 controller ports, while they are on all 246's and can be added to 256, 256B, and Super 256, MOST games have little or no support for them whatsoever. This was completely elective in the game's programming, and sadly, without dongle hacking, will remain mostly the case. In the meantime, if you need to bench-wire a 2X6, my recommendation is to use a PSX controller adapter wired to the sega model 1 JVS IO pcb.

- Gun games appear to be the most problematic of all games on the 2X6 platform, followed by the touchscreen games. The gun games appear to have at least some cross compatibility, but getting them wired up is an absolute nightmare.

- If a game uses a serial port-based IC card reader, you're likely going to have some "fun" with it, even if you have the guns or touchscreen fully working... I think we may be able to fix this however down the road.

- If you want to run Tekken 4, and don't want to deal with the headaches of finding one of the special drives, use a Tekken 4 Ver. D dongle- this version introduces a new ATA and DVD driver that allows it to work on newer drives, but at currently only works on 246 still, not 256.

- Tekken4 Ver. D's updates appear to be usable in a few other games, but not all 246 games to allow newer DVD drives. Sadly, the early "CD-ROM" games are even further picky about the drives used.

- A number of NEC DVD-ROM drives appear to bridge the gap for game compatibility on all 246 games.

- Making a 256 boot the picky 246 games MAY happen, but not without hacks of the games themselves, and right now, there's a LOT of unknowns owing to the somewhat black box nature of the Namco hardware added to the PCB's

- Of all the gun games, Cobra is MOST playable without the official Namco IO, although the official setup uses a full Time Crisis 4 gun setup, with a really ugly gun. The game is playable via the Analog pins on a sega JVS IO without any specific hardware requirement, but is known to often lock up if the card reader is not detected, and although the "check" can be bypassed, if the game cannot read/write to the hardware at certain times, it will hang.

- Taiko Games are an interesting bunch. The best platform for them is of course the 256. While I have a functional PS2 drum adapter modeled up, It's a bit rudimentary, and should probably be redesigned. Converting the games to accept digital IO is going to be near impossible, but a simple mod could be done to make them accept digital IO on the Analog pins of a JVS pcb. The question here is the design of any such panel or button layout. The game has 4 strike locations per drum (left and right rim, and left and right center). Converting to buttons would still require 4 buttons per "drum". Also, the game can sense strike hardness, but it does not appear to affect the actual gameplay, so digital control may be sufficient. Let me know your thoughts.

-The "Asian" versions of Taiko require a 256 with some specific data in its NVRAM or they will non-boot. thus far I've been able to synthetically add this (directly program the EPROM), but on Taiko 11 and later, adding this will PREVENT japanese versions from workign on the same PCB.

As far as some other developments:

- RRV force feedback IO requirement has been bypassed via dongle hack--More information to follow in another thread, so keep an eye out.

- Wangan Midnight R and Wangan Midnight compatibility is being investigated, but may be more complicated than RRV's owing to a slight change in the 246 Driving PCB used. I'll update once more is known, although I have both games on hand.

- I have identified the location of the "region lock" in Taiko Asian versions, and I believe that it may be possible to bypass it with a dongle hack.

- I have been looking at producing modified versions of a few games that did not receive a translation, or could benefit from certain improvements:

- A translation hack for Zeta and Zeta DX.
- Music replacement for Basara X (both the PS2 and Arcade versions suffer from extremely down sampled audio, even though the CD soundtrack is fine.
- Widescreen hacks for a number of fighting games on the platform




Also, as has been clearly alluded to many times, yes, the universal dongle IS in still in the works (I was hoping to get the first units out the door by Jan 1, but clearly my schedule has slipped), and the prototypes are fully functional thus far.
I'm hoping to get the new PCBs in for them before the end of the month, at which point, preorders will start. Initial run will likely be capped to 50 units, but the product will evolve over time via software support and game hacks as they become available, both from myself and others involved in making this happen!


One final note,
If you are in possession (or know of anyone) of the following games, please let me know:

NM00003 Vampire Night (VPN1 Japanese Language)
NM00016 Zoids Infinity (Must be marked S, not T)
NM00022 IDMT Idol Master (Tower, not Satellite)
NM00025 Zoids EX/EX Plus (Must be marked S, not T)
NM00027 Dragon Ball (DB2 Export Language)
NM00028 Druaga Online (Fully working server PC and/or USB dongle for use with the server)
NM00032 Time Crisis 4 (TSF1001-NA-A Japanese Language)
NM000XX Taiko 12 Asian
NM00057 Taiko 14
 
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Also, as has been clearly alluded to many times, yes, the universal dongle IS in still in the works (I was hoping to get the first units out the door by Jan 1, but clearly my schedule has slipped), and the prototypes are fully functional thus far.
I'm hoping to get the new PCBs in for them before the end of the month, at which point, preorders will start. Initial run will likely be capped to 50 units, but the product will evolve over time via software support and game hacks as they become available, both from myself and others involved in making this happen!
Woo! It's happening! Can't wait. ^^



defor wrote:
- Taiko Games are an interesting bunch. The best platformfor them is of course the 256. While I have a functional PS2 drum adaptermodeled up, It's a bit rudimentary, and should probably be redesigned.
As long as it works, I'd totally be down for buying or making a pair of rudimentary PS2 drum adapters. Interested to hear more about these.


The question here is the design of any such panelor button layout. The game has 4 strike locations per drum (left and right rim,and left and right center). Converting to buttons would still require 4 buttonsper "drum". Also, the game can sense strike hardness, but it does notappear to affect the actual gameplay, so digital control may be sufficient. Letme know your thoughts.
If someone were designing just a panel layout for buttons to play the game (and not using drums), I'd say to have something like this...

_O______O_
___O__O__

Using some type of dome push buttons (the 100mm kind used on Bishi Bashi and Project Diva, not the larger Pop'n Music ones) would probably give the best overall play experience.
 
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Sorry, been working on finishing up the groundwork for opening the 246/256 to some more usability and haven't had time to pop in recently-
Hoping to get a proper thread up soon with the details of what's going on on my side when things have calmed down.

Anyway- looking through the questions:

- System 256 imho is a better platform as far as compatibility goes- as only a small number of early games for the 246 won't run on it- although many are "iconic" to the system: RRV, BR3, Tekken4...

- As far as the PS2 controller ports, while they are on all 246's and can be added to 256, 256B, and Super 256, MOST games have little or no support for them whatsoever. This was completely elective in the game's programming, and sadly, without dongle hacking, will remain mostly the case. In the meantime, if you need to bench-wire a 2X6, my recommendation is to use a PSX controller adapter wired to the sega model 1 JVS IO pcb.

- Gun games appear to be the most problematic of all games on the 2X6 platform, followed by the touchscreen games. The gun games appear to have at least some cross compatibility, but getting them wired up is an absolute nightmare.

- If a game uses a serial port-based IC card reader, you're likely going to have some "fun" with it, even if you have the guns or touchscreen fully working... I think we may be able to fix this however down the road.

- If you want to run Tekken 4, and don't want to deal with the headaches of finding one of the special drives, use a Tekken 4 Ver. D dongle- this version introduces a new ATA and DVD driver that allows it to work on newer drives, but at currently only works on 246 still, not 256.

- Tekken4 Ver. D's updates appear to be usable in a few other games, but not all 246 games to allow newer DVD drives. Sadly, the early "CD-ROM" games are even further picky about the drives used.

- A number of NEC DVD-ROM drives appear to bridge the gap for game compatibility on all 246 games.

- Making a 256 boot the picky 246 games MAY happen, but not without hacks of the games themselves, and right now, there's a LOT of unknowns owing to the somewhat black box nature of the Namco hardware added to the PCB's

- Of all the gun games, Cobra is MOST playable without the official Namco IO, although the official setup uses a full Time Crisis 4 gun setup, with a really ugly gun. The game is playable via the Analog pins on a sega JVS IO without any specific hardware requirement, but is known to often lock up if the card reader is not detected, and although the "check" can be bypassed, if the game cannot read/write to the hardware at certain times, it will hang.

- Taiko Games are an interesting bunch. The best platform for them is of course the 256. While I have a functional PS2 drum adapter modeled up, It's a bit rudimentary, and should probably be redesigned. Converting the games to accept digital IO is going to be near impossible, but a simple mod could be done to make them accept digital IO on the Analog pins of a JVS pcb. The question here is the design of any such panel or button layout. The game has 4 strike locations per drum (left and right rim, and left and right center). Converting to buttons would still require 4 buttons per "drum". Also, the game can sense strike hardness, but it does not appear to affect the actual gameplay, so digital control may be sufficient. Let me know your thoughts.

-The "Asian" versions of Taiko require a 256 with some specific data in its NVRAM or they will non-boot. thus far I've been able to synthetically add this (directly program the EPROM), but on Taiko 11 and later, adding this will PREVENT japanese versions from workign on the same PCB.

As far as some other developments:

- RRV force feedback IO requirement has been bypassed via dongle hack--More information to follow in another thread, so keep an eye out.

- Wangan Midnight R and Wangan Midnight compatibility is being investigated, but may be more complicated than RRV's owing to a slight change in the 246 Driving PCB used. I'll update once more is known, although I have both games on hand.

- I have identified the location of the "region lock" in Taiko Asian versions, and I believe that it may be possible to bypass it with a dongle hack.

- I have been looking at producing modified versions of a few games that did not receive a translation, or could benefit from certain improvements:

- A translation hack for Zeta and Zeta DX.
- Music replacement for Basara X (both the PS2 and Arcade versions suffer from extremely down sampled audio, even though the CD soundtrack is fine.
- Widescreen hacks for a number of fighting games on the platform




Also, as has been clearly alluded to many times, yes, the universal dongle IS in still in the works (I was hoping to get the first units out the door by Jan 1, but clearly my schedule has slipped), and the prototypes are fully functional thus far.
I'm hoping to get the new PCBs in for them before the end of the month, at which point, preorders will start. Initial run will likely be capped to 50 units, but the product will evolve over time via software support and game hacks as they become available, both from myself and others involved in making this happen!


One final note,
If you are in possession (or know of anyone) of the following games, please let me know:

NM00003 Vampire Night (VPN1 Japanese Language)
NM00016 Zoids Infinity (Must be marked , not [T])
NM00022 IDMT Idol Master (Tower, not Satellite)
NM00025 Zoids EX/EX Plus (Must be marked , not [T])
NM00027 Dragon Ball (DB2 Export Language)
NM00028 Druaga Online (Fully working server PC and/or USB dongle for use with the server)
NM00032 Time Crisis 4 (TSF1001-NA-A Japanese Language)
NM000XX Taiko 12 Asian
NM00057 Taiko 14

This post is epic. Why don't you open a new thread with information about this system and you can update as soon as more things are known.

Also you can open presales for your multi if you so wish.
 
This post is epic. Why don't you open a new thread with information about this system and you can update as soon as more things are known.
Also you can open presales for your multi if you so wish.
Seconding this. I'd throw money at you now. XD
 
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