Golden Axe and Shinobi Cart Issues

I decided (on some good advice from @pierpa86 ) to create a new thread for my issues.

The post below has new information if you saw it in the Golden Axe thread.

I'll indicate new info with ***

I attempted to create Golden Axe and Shinobi carts today.

The long story, short, is that Shinobi works and Golden Axe does not...

*** Shinobi works on MV1C
*** Shinobi does not work on MV1B
*** Golden Axe and Shinobi both display the colorful checkerboard like when no bios is loaded
*** Tested on multiple MV1B motherboards

I'm using identical donors for both carts (Super Sidekicks 2).

*** Both donor carts worked well before conversion.

*** The below information is from my testing on MV1C.

Golden Axe just goes straight to the crosshatch.

One time (only once), I got a garbled NEOGEO on the unibios screen, followed by the silent Neo Geo splash (normal). There was some slight garbage in the splash. a little rectangle that didn't belong.

When the attract mode tried to start I got the crosshatch.

The ROM configuration is the same for both. Golden Axe and Shinobi:

m1 - 27c1001
s1 - 27c1001 - swapped pins 2 & 24
c1 - 27c160
c2 - 27c160
p1 - 27c160
v1 - 27c160
v2 - 27c160
v3 - 27c160
v4 - 27c160

Jumpers (same on shinobi):

PROGTOP:
- J1
- J9
- J13
- J16
- J17

CHA256:
- J2
- J3
- J7
- J8
- R1
- R2
- R3
- R4

PROGTOP



PROGTOP BACK


CHA256

CHA256 BACK


V1 pin 28 ring came off while I was removing the original ROMS. I expose the copper on the trace and patched a small piece of wire from the pin to the newly exposed trace.

I have the same thing happen to a pin on V1 on Shinobi and patched the same way. It came out better on Shinobi but it's not as bad as the image appears.

Any thoughts?

So far, @pierpa has suggested:

pierpa86 said:

Hello dude,
if Golden Axe just goes straight to the crosshatch -> go check your P1 eprom.
1) desolder it and try to dump to check.
2) on progtop for 2MB V rom and 2MB P1 rom is ok = J1 + J9 + J13 and J17+J16

Again, if game do not boot, check your P eprom... ( and its trace )

Are you sure that S1 pins exposed on back prob board do not short on it ? cover it !
Have you washed prog pin with alcohol?
If you get critical error during game play, check neo-273 on CHA, sometimes need to be clean also with al alcohol.

Click to expand...

I will do this but the failure of Shinobi on MV1B is strange.

Edit: Shinobi works on MV1A as well.
Golden Axe works on nothing still.

I'm out of motherboard variants so I'll pull P1 and check it out.

After you check P1 if every things if ok
under this pin you have the 5v and the gnd, be careful not to make a short.
check also short on neo 273 by dust



have you double p1 on 27c160 ?

pierpa86 said:

After you check P1 if every things if ok
under this pin you have the 5v and the gnd, be careful not to make a short.
check also short on neo 273 by dust

have you double p1 on 27c160 ?

Click to expand...

Thanks for the suggestions and p ROM.

I checked for short under s1 and nothing there.

Neo 273 seems clean? I cleaned it again.

I pulled my p ROM and compared to yours. It matches perfectly.

I put it back in and and now it boots will clear graphics but fails once attract would normally start.

I can hear the fancy sounding music in the background. I get nothing but colored horizontal stripes scrolling vertically.

It looks like this.



The diagonal dashed lines are not always present.

I went back and checked the traces on all the V ROMs. They test good. Now.

Some more rings were damaged and I repaired.

I'm getting past the Hoffman credits/intro but crashing with garbage all over the screen. Right after.

Do you have unibios ?
Its crash with error code ? Or only graphics become garbage ?

I do have unibios 4.0 free.

Graphics become garbage. It never actually hard crashes.

After garbage graphics, music still plays. Coin insert works (plays chime). No other controls seem to work once the graphics go to garage. Can't like start the game in the background.

One time I saw the bottom half of Axe Battler from the character select screen before everything went to garbage. Maybe a portion of the background in there too.

The screen continuously updates with different garbage. That's just a grab of it at some random garbage.

Here's a video of it in action:

View: https://youtu.be/MWknUT0XE0Q?si=0JU9CquZz0YIZm_E

I spent a lot of time on this last night and today.

I made some progress, but I'm more confused now...

I pulled the C ROMs and verified them. They were all messed up.
It's possible I flashed the wrong ROMs. I have not investigated it fully.

I programmed new C ROMs and installed them. The title screen and some of the graphics were looking better better but I still couldn't play the game.
The attract mode was working but there were some black boxes on the screen and a lot of graphics missing.

I thought this was related to the S rom. I pulled the S ROM and my programmer couldn't read it. So, I programmed another.
I was using M27C1001. I switched to MX27C1000 (with pins 2/24 inverted) and installed it.

That's where I am now.

The symptoms I am experiencing are strange.

I tested with 3 MV1C, 1 MV1A, and 2 MV1B motherboards. All behave the same.

MV1C - with the cartridge shell - can't play. Graphics corruption. After game starts no character sprites not visible. Automatic deaths.

View: https://youtube.com/shorts/MW5Okm_Ft3o


MV1C - without cartridge shell - sometimes I can play the entire game! Attract mode has some issues related to text.
Sometimes it performs exactly like without the shell. I can't figure out why. I don't believe anything is shorting.

View: https://youtube.com/shorts/97Ua-Y4RccM


MV1A - WORKS PERFECTLY!

View: https://youtube.com/shorts/41UEHFuMKHE


MV1B - Does not work at all. colored checkerboard screen.

So that's why this is so strange. If I only had an MV1A I would think the cart is perfect.

I don't really use the MV1A, so this is not as easy to accept as if it only worked on the MV1C.

I'm not sure where to go from here.

1) no crash error on unibios, so P1 is ok and prog top is ok also, audio is ok next.
2) if any data is wrong on C eprom, you got garbage graphics in a spot not on the whole screen.
3) if you got problem on neo-273 you have crash.
4) s1 pin swap work as well, you can hear audio. no problem here
5) if you got garbage data on M you can see problem only on fixed sprite not on whole screen.

to me its seems a short on c eprom,
to do: desolder C rom, integrity test on programmer, resolder using frux, be sure that you are making a nice contact without short on between pins.
what the speed of your 27c160 ?

tested here with a prog top and cha 256b and its working fine.
So no problem with this configuration, something wrong on your cart.

I read your updates now, if the game changes its problem with or without shell, it is definitely a short somewhere.
If the problem is locatel on text and life bar, that are fixed sprite. so check S.
do not flip pin on s rom, just cut them and solder a wire, use black tape to isolate.
wrong voltage on eprom make data on gargabe, if you are lucky you can clean and reprogram.

now desolder and check your graphics eprom, C an S, check it with programmer, solder back them, and isolate two board also S flipper pin ( best if you can cut pins, do not flip them)

pierpa86 said:

I read your updates now, if the game changes its problem with or without shell, it is definitely a short somewhere.
If the problem is locatel on text and life bar, that are fixed sprite. so check S.
do not flip pin on s rom, just cut them and solder a wire, use black tape to isolate.
wrong voltage on eprom make data on gargabe, if you are lucky you can clean and reprogram.

now desolder and check your graphics eprom, C an S, check it with programmer, solder back them, and isolate two board also S flipper pin ( best if you can cut pins, do not flip them)

Click to expand...

I already have the S ROM 2/24 PINS cut with wires running to the opposite pin.

I have already pulled the C ROMs and S ROM and verified them.

I have checked for shorts and cut traces and I don't find any.

I always use flux for all soldering. I don't know how anyone can solder without flux.

It works perfect on MV1A with the boards in the cartridge shell.

I would try cleaning the cart edge connectors and your cart slot. Not having a case is likely allowing the boards to be inserted farther into the slot so the metal to metal connection between the slot/cart edge will be in a different location on the cart edge then you would get with the case'd boards. You might just have oxidation causing a bad connection depending on where the metal to metal connection is happening. Even if the cart edge looks clean there can be oxidation on it.

This same type of thing can happen when trying different motherboards as there are a couple different types of slot connectors, each with their own metal to metal connection point.

ack said:

I would try cleaning the cart edge connectors and your cart slot. Not having a case is likely allowing the boards to be inserted farther into the slot so the metal to metal connection between the slot/cart edge will be in a different location on the cart edge then you would get with the case'd boards. You might just have oxidation causing a bad connection depending on where the metal to metal connection is happening. Even if the cart edge looks clean there can be oxidation on it.

This same type of thing can happen when trying different motherboards as there are a couple different types of slot connectors, each with their own metal to metal connection point.

Click to expand...

Thanks. I've been leaning in that direction.

The carts should be clean by now. I have really worked on them and I'm not seeing any black come up on the swab when using de-oxit.

Both games can be played to the end, even in the shells; so I think they are assembled well.

The carts are sensitive to how they are making connection. It helps if I back them off a little bit.

I have used a little de-oxit in the cart slots and it seems to have helped.

I probably do have to get in there are really clean the cart slots. I'm not looking forward to it.

It is still curious that no other carts have this issue. I have over 20 carts and none need any special attention.

I still don't understand why the cart doesn't work in any mv1b. I don't even get crosshatch. I get flashing screen like no bios.

I might have to open another thread to focus on that issue and what could cause it.

Now I'm the one having trouble making another shinobi cart and a Golden Axe cart.
Shinobi have sound problems, reprogrammed and verified all V roms, verified M1 too, jumpers checked too, its the same config that I have made in the first one that works.
Golden Axe I have graphic problems, reprogrammed and verified all C roms, its like jailbars on screen, (I forgot to record a video)....
Tried jumpers as same as in shinobi, but I couldn't make it work....
Tested on 3 different mobos and its the same in all of them.....
Any tips to resolve this problems?

That s1 ROM doesn't need pins 2/24 swapped?

First rule that i learn on MVS... clean your board !

Wash it with chanteclair and alcohol, use glass fiber for pin, its seems rusty and dirty.

GeorgeSpinner said:

That s1 ROM doesn't need pins 2/24 swapped?

Click to expand...

It's a 27C1000, no need to swap pins, S1 is for the fix layer, if S1 has any problem, the credit coundn't been seen, or health bars.

pierpa86 said:

First rule that i learn on MVS... clean your board !

Wash it with chanteclair and alcohol, use glass fiber for pin, its seems rusty and dirty.

Click to expand...

It's dirty but there is no rust, I don't want to kill another cart just to test it, I'm gonna to take out the eprom from cha board that I assemble Shinobi to see if it works, with Golden Axe and vice versa but I'm tired of delsodering eproms....

GarouSP said:

Now I'm the one having trouble making another shinobi cart and a Golden Axe cart.
Shinobi have sound problems, reprogrammed and verified all V roms, verified M1 too, jumpers checked too, its the same config that I have made in the first one that works.

Golden Axe I have graphic problems, reprogrammed and verified all C roms, its like jailbars on screen, (I forgot to record a video)....
Tried jumpers as same as in shinobi, but I couldn't make it work....
Tested on 3 different mobos and its the same in all of them.....
Any tips to resolve this problems?

Click to expand...

There's corrosion on the far right and left pins, use a fiberglass pen or a very fine sandpaper and see if gets any better.

If anyone need :