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GeeDee

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Since we're slowly reaching a point where *multiple* FS threads have more questions asking about prices, missing or otherwise, or simply devolve into sh*tposting, I think it's for the best that there be a dedicated thread where we can legitimately talk about whether or not certain things are an issue and what the collective consensus is on the FS rules without cluttering up other users FS threads. Let's not forget Rule 6: "do not poison other users FS threads", and I think it could be argued that derailing a thread to debate about rules-that-arent-rules could probably fall under that. I think AP is pretty respectful and welcoming in terms of arcade forum marketplaces, and I'd like to see it stay that way imo. Best to put your thoughts out there in the right place in the right way then make a stink of the place. :) If nothing comes of this thread and everything stays as it is, then 110% cool; if that's what the community wants. I just would rather see issues brought up and talked about here in one place rather than derailing users' FS threads. Rules haven't been touched in ~3-4 years, so I think it's fair game to give them a once-over consideration anyway.



Currently, I think the main issue on most folks' minds is that it currently isn't *required* to declare a price when listing an item/creating a FS thread.

As it stands now, the rules state that a *buyer* must be knowledgeable about prices beforehand, and the seller is only required to list the *sold* price, though for many, I'm not sure this is cutting the mustard anymore; especially for high-value, dog-piling items. Considering many have concerns over "who was first" and availability, and concerns over things devolving into auctions over DMs, this should probably be addressed first. Mind you, I wouldn't consider this "price policing"- I (and most others) aren't bringing up issues with prices being too high or low, just whether or not there should be a baseline as a starting point. I think it's more a matter of organization and not allowing users to point fingers at one another over who-offered-what in private before a number was ever on the table to begin with, but that's not for me alone to decide. I also think it's more than a little bit of a headache for the sellers. Not naming names and not pointing fingers, but I would hate to be on the receiving end of 20-30+ unique (unwarranted) DMs being offered different numbers from so many different people and then having to play the pick-and-choose game. Sure, the seller gets a check at the end of the day, but (imo) prospective buyers lose by not wanting to devolve into unwarranted DM's out of respect for OP who will "list prices later", and the seller loses by being put in a DM disaster via overzealous and overaggressive buyers. Again, not my place alone to decide, but I don't think it's a bad idea to have a good, singular thread to talk about this without making thread after thread in the feedback section or derailing other users' FS posts. :thumbup:


Here's a Poll so opinions can be realistically tallied: Should prices be required for listing items for sale?

Edit: Typos/clarity.

For reference, here's a repost of the current (1/9/2022) rules so folks don't have to jump between threads:

You are allowed to sell whatever you like here that is arcade related. We ask you to adhere to a few simple yet important rules:


Rule 1: B
egin the subject of your sale thread with a suffix. For example, if you are simply selling an item you should use the suffix 'For Sale:' or 'FS:'

Rule 2: You can sell bootlegs but they MUST be clearly identified as such. Preferably in the subject line of your thread. Pictures will help prevent any issues also.

Rule 3: You cannot list an item as untested unless it actually is untested. It is expected that you will list non-working parts as such.

Rule 4: We ask that you do not resell one of the Darksoft or Walsdawg products here while they are still in production or available. This applies to products we design not products we may resell.

Rule 5: We ask that once an item has been sold that you leave the price so that people may refer to it in the future. If you keep a running thread simply list it in the first post somewhere. Example: Neo-Geo cart-----sold! $25. We also ask for you to update the original post with the final sold price. If you tried to sell for $25 but ended up selling for $20, it should go like this: $25 $20. Each user is expected to do this and it can only benefit everyone.

Rule 6: We will not tolerate members poisoning another member's sales thread. This includes 'price policing' which brings us to:

Rule 7: It is the responsibility of the buyer to research and be knowledgeable of the going rate for any particular item. If you are unsure do a 'price check' to gain opinions from other members.

Rule 8: You must always represent your items for sale in a truthful, honest, and non-deceptive fashion. This includes item condition, taking care to mention any obvious blemishes that the buyer might find undesirable.

Rule 9: If a buyer feels they have been scammed or they are unable to amicably resolve a disagreement with the other party a MOD may be assigned to act as a mediator. In this case the decision of the MOD is final.

Rule 10: You cannot sell anything illegal to ship through the mail. This includes but is not limited to drugs, alcohol, firearms, human or animal remains, etc.

Rule 11: Failure to adhere to these simple rules can result in loss of sale forum privileges or banishment from the site altogether.

Rule 12: Anyone who uses the sales or wanted forums must at least have their general location listed in their profile. A post asking for your location is a waste of time.


In order to allow members to get an idea of the type of seller you are you may want to include your eBay seller ID so that other members may feel more comfortable doing business with you.

(Amended 1/26/17)
 
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tiff_lee

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Not naming names and not pointing fingers, but I would hate to be on the receiving end of 20-30+ unique (unwarranted) DMs being offered different numbers from so many different people and then having to play the pick-and-choose game. Sure, the seller gets a check at the end of the day, but (imo) prospective buyers lose by not wanting to devolve into unwarranted DM out of respect for OP who will "list prices later", and the buyer loses by being put in a DM disaster via overzealous and overaggressive buyers. Again, not my place alone to decide, but I don't think it's a bad idea to have a good, singular thread to talk about this without making thread after thread in the feedback section or derailing other users' FS posts. :thumbup:
In my experience that behaviour is by design and intended to illicit the exact response you described there, give individuals who 'list prices later' a heads up on what people are prepared to pay as an opening gambit.

The only real gripe I have with the classified section is that someone can create a new account and head straight to the for sale section for their first post because ultimately that's all they wanna do here $$$
 

ekorz

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do we have a problem with listing that accept offers versus listing prices?
 

jassin000

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@ekorz in a FS (for sale) thread? Yes!
The rules clearly state you must list a price, and even after that item is sold, keep the price it sold for posted.

Now IC (interest check) threads are a little different.
Here we allow the rule to be disregarded, because its not technically "FS" yet (and may never be if further biz is conducted via direct PM). ;)

I believe the intent behind this rule is clear...
We do NOT want to become another eBay!
 

GeeDee

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do we have a problem with listing that accept offers versus listing prices?

@jassin000 s got it- you gotta list the sold price, no matter what. The entire purpose of that rule is to make it easier for buyers and sellers to find confident listing/asking prices for future sales of the same item.

As far as /listing/ that you'll consider offers, though:
I think "OBO" is a two-way street and that's used plenty here already. I think (and I'm sure I'm not the only one) that when I see "OBO" I immediately go to "Oh, they're willing to Take Less for the item", but "Best Offer" can just as easily mean a higher number as well, to be fair. Though "OBO" almost always comes after a baseline price. If you list an item as "$100 - OBO" and someone offers you $4K, you're only responsible for editing the listing to say that 4K was the sold price :P lol. However, it's just having that starting baseline number that I think is the current problem. Totally my own opinion: but I think it's fair to assume buyers be just as knowledgable as sellers regarding their items before posting and confidently listing a starting number along with it. The rules already state that sellers are inclined to use the Price Check thread if they're not sure of a value, though buyers are welcome to do just the same before posting a thread and listing their items (and this has definitely been done before, anyways).
 

ekorz

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So everyone is happy if a seller wants to list boards without prices, but titles the post “IC” instead of “FS”?
 

GeeDee

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So everyone is happy if a seller wants to list boards without prices, but titles the post “IC” instead of “FS”?

Good question, and again just an imo, but I think that'd just be a silly loophole :rolleyes:

"Interest Check! Is anyone interested in my DDP?"

"Yes!"

"Is anyone interested in my DDP...for 6K?"

"uuuuuuhhh..."


IC threads probably need at least a little "regulation" to keep things fair, imo. Otherwise, let's say OP does this whole ludicrous price thing in DMs, then the then prospective buyer posts in their IC thread, "They wanted me to pay $xyz for this- don't bother DMing". Then you would be "price policing" since OP couldn't just confidently post their price to begin with 🤔

Small edit: I think "Interest Checks" have served the best purposes here when it's about a manufactured item and OP has to decide how many of whatever it is to make. Not so much 2nd hand sales.
 

djsheep

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So everyone is happy if a seller wants to list boards without prices, but titles the post “IC” instead of “FS”?
Nah, take that shit to eBay.

Honestly, if "Interest Check" sale threads become the norm, it's just asking for some (not all) sellers to start price goughing for the highest dollar over PM, and the whole "forum deals" ethos will be lost.

Sellers should know what their wares are worth to them and sell them as such. There's a "Price Check" thread, and that should be used instead IMO.
 

ekorz

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Let’s talk about selling a DDP then. I want to sell mine (hypothetically please don’t DM). I’d love it to go to a contributing forum member versus a lurker with no rep and quick fingers (“first!”). It helps the active community and increases my trust in the purchase being legit.

How should we go about that? Or is that not fair to let the seller have that flexibility? I should take the to private PM’s with only my friends here?
 

djsheep

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There's zero issues IMO to hit up potential buyers direct who've posted WTB threads or expressed interest or even your close peeps on here or IRL.

I think this thread is specifically related to posting up items for sale and the etiquette that revolves around listing items publically for sale.
 

GeeDee

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How should we go about that? Or is that not fair to let the seller have that flexibility?

Definitely a rock-and-a-hard-place, I agree. I understand wanting to respect the pecking order and honoring whoever expressed interest first, but I'll admit even I have some bias on this (though I've never acted on it with my own sales here; being transparent).

There was a talk some time ago about giving a discount on some popular/expensive shmup board to anyone who could come over and 1CC it before buying. I forget what the game was or who was selling and I dont really think it matters for the example to stick. Frankly, I'm all for that, but I know it's not a popular opinion with collectors :P I know folks who dump tens of thousands of hours into these games and I really like seeing when someone dedicated to the /fun of the game/ is able to finally get their hands on it at a fair price, rather then someone with a nice looking shelf. Fully admit this is a personal bias, but it's important to respect the rules of the forum first and foremost- ergo why hopefully this thread accomplishes something.

tl;dr, agree that this is also an issue, but like DJ mentions, atm the topic is on whether an item should be required to have a listed starting price, and I think that should be tackled first, imo.
 

ekorz

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when you have a lot of friends or a lot of desire to give back to the active side of the community… that’s a lot of PMs. Also will prevent me from selling to someone who is active but that I’m not friendly with.

Faster to just toss up these “coming soon” type of posts. Which is why I think it’s happening. Nobody says “ten copies of capcom bowling, prices soon”
 

ekorz

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guess that (FS then picking favorites among the inquiries) feels wrong to me in a way that “prices later” feels less wrong. FS to me is about respecting who is first with an offer that matches my post. But I guess that’s not explicit in the rules either? I’d be pissed if I was first at asking price and someone else got the board. And someone offering more to snake it is also awful.

I don’t actually do these posts, I just don’t mind them either. Just trying to see how the other side’s arguments can stand.

I suppose I accomplish the same goal with “trade only”. I really am looking for a trade but if the “right” buyer sent a cash offer I’d consider it. Is that frowned upon?
 

GeeDee

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What the FUCK is an INTEREST check?

"Hey anyone interested in buying rare and highly sought after PCBs on a PCB forum... I just don't know..."

It's bullshit for popular boards.

Agree with the sentiment about IC threads, but let's make sure we follow the title and keep things respectful :P

I think it would do a lot of good to have a place to talk about these kinda things, but I'd hate to see mods lock it up out of the blue how they've done before, just because they don't like the vocab.

Just echoing from my own post about this too: "I think "Interest Checks" have served the best purposes here when it's about a manufactured item and OP has to decide how many of whatever it is to make. Not so much 2nd hand sales." and even then, OP usually has a price in mind for their to-be-created items.


guess that (FS then picking favorites among the inquiries) feels wrong to me in a way that “prices later” feels less wrong. FS to me is about respecting who is first with an offer that matches my post.

I can understand the sentiment here- it's a tough spot to have two or three very active members chime in on an item all at once, then get rejected because you're not a "close enough" friend. I think it's also fair to WANT to sell to people you like, even if it's just to boost confidence in that you won't get a chargeback or some lie about shipping damages from a new user with no prior buy/sell history here. This has been brought up before (and promptly rejected iirc), but the main argument/solution is to require a certain post count to view the marketplace.

Just to reiterate, I think the current topic is primarily on listing prices in FS threads, and I think it should stay that way, but I understand that all of these issues can be cumulative to the whole experience.

Personally, I think you can have the highest post count on the site and still have/give some dodgy opinions/advice :rolleyes: but I also think you can view that separately from the marketplace perspective. I don't think a higher post count makes your arguments "more valid" in a debate about, say, if a game is good or not, but I DO think you can have garbage opinions about games AND be able to pack and ship with confidence :P having a history /here/, specifically, does give me more confidence that you can send me high-dollar stuff and I don't have to be worried about the shipping condition or payment issues after the fact.
 

ekorz

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@GeeDee i am talking about “reasons why” people might list things in FS posts without prices. Sorry if that was not clear. I consider myself on-topic. I think it’s because a seller wants flexibility in who they are selling to.
 

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Why not just list your shit for sale for a price. 30 people PM you, you don't have to go with the order the PMs came in, just pick your "friend" out of the group.
Oh I know what, b/c interest checks are just a way to drive up price and get the most. An auction, a silent auction.

A certain thread right now had Night Slashers listed, then the OP said, don't worry, I'm still getting prices together, then suddenly, NS is on hold... hmmm...

Yeah. I'm pissed I didn't get to get my 6ths NS PCB, what of it?!?!

:P
 

XtraSmiley

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Oh, just to be clear, I'm not mad or anything, I'm just joking around.

It's fucking video games! Stay chill, poke some fun, have fun.

Hell, I just paid a shit ton over market price for a PCB just to help make a fan documentary about a company I know very little about!

EDIT: Edited my posts to be more respectful... :P
 
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