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buffi

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Putting this under ideas, since it's something I've been thinking about a bit, but dunno if I'll bother making one.

What triggered me to thinking about it more was this video:
View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kZOe7aaiqqE


Basically, USB-C supports multiple voltages including 12V and 5V, and pretty high current levels.

Seems like it should be possible to make a supergun with two USB-C ports as input for power.

Basically, get a fancy charger like this:
https://www.amazon.com/UGREEN-100W-USB-Multiport-Charger/dp/B091Z6JNX4
Use port1 to 5V, port 2 for 12V.

This will give 9A at 5V, 2.5A as 12V, which should be sufficient for most hardware.

Then just get two trigger modules, and jumper one for 5V and one for 12V.
https://www.amazon.com/Type-C-Trigger-Module-Supports-Output/dp/B08LDJBN8P?th=1

Design a PCB based on Minigun or similar, with footprints for the trigger modules onboard.

... and that should be it? No need for big PSU.

Am I missing something, why doesn't this exist?
 

ShootTheCore

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Sounds good in theory, but plan on including a trim dial to adjust the 5V for load from the game board.
 

xodaraP

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Putting this under ideas, since it's something I've been thinking about a bit, but dunno if I'll bother making one.

What triggered me to thinking about it more was this video:
View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kZOe7aaiqqE


Basically, USB-C supports multiple voltages including 12V and 5V, and pretty high current levels.

Seems like it should be possible to make a supergun with two USB-C ports as input for power.

Basically, get a fancy charger like this:
https://www.amazon.com/UGREEN-100W-USB-Multiport-Charger/dp/B091Z6JNX4
Use port1 to 5V, port 2 for 12V.

This will give 9A at 5V, 2.5A as 12V, which should be sufficient for most hardware.

Then just get two trigger modules, and jumper one for 5V and one for 12V.
https://www.amazon.com/Type-C-Trigger-Module-Supports-Output/dp/B08LDJBN8P?th=1

Design a PCB based on Minigun or similar, with footprints for the trigger modules onboard.

... and that should be it? No need for big PSU.

Am I missing something, why doesn't this exist?

I guess it doesn’t exist because no one with the skills has made it. Existing power supplies work fine and to support USB-C takes quite a few extra components and modifications to existing designs

It would require a lot of work to redesign it and would cost more to build, and it’s unlikely people would pay extra for it over existing Supergun designs to cover the cost

I’ve consolized an MVS 2 slot with USB-C power and I have built a USB-C powered Minigun using a trigger board and buck converters along with modified consoles etc

I’ve been doing some work to try and build a more complete/integrated solution but I need to find time to work on it properly
 

xodaraP

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Sounds good in theory, but plan on including a trim dial to adjust the 5V for load from the game board.

No need. As long as you use a sufficient power supply it will work fine and the output current will adjust automatically

I have tested quite a few boards with a 100W USB-C power supply and haven’t found anything yet that wouldn’t boot

Boards that normally need 5.1v etc need more current but traditional arcade PSUs only have a voltage adjustment, you can’t increase current
 

RealMFnG

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I guess it doesn’t exist because no one with the skills has made it. Existing power supplies work fine and to support USB-C takes quite a few extra components and modifications to existing designs

It would require a lot of work to redesign it and would cost more to build, and it’s unlikely people would pay extra for it over existing Supergun designs to cover the cost

I’ve consolized an MVS 2 slot with USB-C power and I have built a USB-C powered Minigun using a trigger board and buck converters along with modified consoles etc

I’ve been doing some work to try and build a more complete/integrated solution but I need to find time to work on it properly
Is there something more involved than to just replace the Mini-Fit Jr connector and re-working the traces on frank_fjs's miniGun?
 

buffi

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I guess it doesn’t exist because no one with the skills has made it. Existing power supplies work fine and to support USB-C takes quite a few extra components and modifications to existing designs

It would require a lot of work to redesign it and would cost more to build, and it’s unlikely people would pay extra for it over existing Supergun designs to cover the cost
I don't know if I agree here really.
Sure there's extra components needed, but my understanding is that two trigger boards should be sufficient if you just need 12V and 5V? That has a total cost of 12$ on amazon, and I guess less on aliexpress. Then you need a beefy dual output USB-C adapter, but that's still not really much pricier than a cheap arcade PSU.

Redesigning something like a Minigun to use this instead of the Molex connector for power seems like it should be extremely easy?
 

xodaraP

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If you’re using 2 trigger boards you would need to use 2 separate power supplies. A USB-C PSU won’t output 2 voltages simultaneously

You also have the issue that 12v is part of the PD standard but not all power supplies have it. Most do 5v and 20v only as these are the standard voltages used by phones and laptops

There is a further issue where if your PD supply does do 12v - the standard is 12v @ 1A which isn’t enough if you then reduce the 12v rail down to achieve your 5v rail

The way around this is to use 20v @ 5A - this way you have enough current to account for the loss in conversion to both 12v and 5v and have enough power available to run the board

Most boards don’t use much on the 12v side. The 5v is the main requirement
 

xodaraP

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Is there something more involved than to just replace the Mini-Fit Jr connector and re-working the traces on frank_fjs's miniGun?

You need to add extra space for the trigger board and buck converters

Ideally you would move all of these components onto the main PCB itself and have a single USB-C input but this is what would require a lot more work
 

buffi

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If you’re using 2 trigger boards you would need to use 2 separate power supplies. A USB-C PSU won’t output 2 voltages simultaneously

You also have the issue that 12v is part of the PD standard but not all power supplies have it. Most do 5v and 20v only as these are the standard voltages used by phones and laptops

There is a further issue where if your PD supply does do 12v - the standard is 12v @ 1A which isn’t enough if you then reduce the 12v rail down to achieve your 5v rail

The way around this is to use 20v @ 5A - this way you have enough current to account for the loss in conversion to both 12v and 5v and have enough power available to run the board

Most boards don’t use much on the 12v side. The 5v is the main requirement
Did you see the supply I linked?
https://www.amazon.com/UGREEN-100W-USB-Multiport-Charger/dp/B091Z6JNX4
(https://eu.ugreen.com/products/ugreen-nexode-100w-usb-c-wall-charger)

My understanding is that this will do different voltages in the different ports just fine. 12V is within spec for it.
You just need to make sure to get a good USB-C PSU with the proper supports.
 

xodaraP

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I have considered building and have prototyped a USB-C arcade power supply. Have a molex or similar output for connection to a supergun with USB-C input

But this seemed like a waste when it would cost more than a normal arcade PSU to build and have more limited application

A proper USB-C powered supergun would be amazing just a lot of work
 

buffi

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You need to add extra space for the trigger board and buck converters

Ideally you would move all of these components onto the main PCB itself and have a single USB-C input but this is what would require a lot more work
Yeah I mean, that's what I'm saying.

Taking the Minigun design and redoing the PCB to have onboard room for the trigger boards is extremely easy.

Having a single USB-C input and buck converters would be even nicer probably yeah. Also not that much work.

If Minigun was designed in Kicad, it would be like... maybe an hours work?

Even just redrawing the entire schematic in Kicad, and routing a pcb is like a days work at most.
 

xodaraP

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Did you see the supply I linked?
https://www.amazon.com/UGREEN-100W-USB-Multiport-Charger/dp/B091Z6JNX4
(https://eu.ugreen.com/products/ugreen-nexode-100w-usb-c-wall-charger)

My understanding is that this will do different voltages in the different ports just fine. 12V is within spec for it.
You just need to make sure to get a good USB-C PSU with the proper supports.

The maximum current output of that power supply is 2.4A on 5v - enough for MVS, not enough for CPS2/3 or S16

It will also be reduced if you’re using 2 voltages at once
 

buffi

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The maximum current output of that power supply is 2.4A on 5v - enough for MVS, not enough for CPS2/3 or S16

It will also be reduced if you’re using 2 voltages at once
Ah, alright! I had a hard time figuring out the specs for individual voltages there.
In that case I agree that onboard buck converter from a single voltage seems a lot better.
 

buffi

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The way around this is to use 20v @ 5A - this way you have enough current to account for the loss in conversion to both 12v and 5v and have enough power available to run the board
Sorry for quote spam, but just wanted to quote this to agree with you.

It looks like the Amps on 5V in general on these isn't that beefy, and going the 20V route with buck converters seems like a better choice.

So basically, can someone please:
- Take Minigun design
- Redesign the PCB to replace Molex plug with a USB-C trigger board
- Add a power section with DC-DC converters for 5V and 12V
- (maybe) also add a Negatron converter for -5V
- Sell this to me :)

Otherwise I can probably do it myself, but I don't have time for that right now :D

(Bonus points if adding USB-HID support for controls ;) )
 

RealMFnG

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Another approach would be to make a daughterboard that fits into the pinout of the miniGun. Existing owners can then use it no sweat.
 

xodaraP

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I’m in exactly the same position but also have no ability to design or modify a design for a PCB

I can build it and maybe diagnose it if it doesn’t work but that’s as far as I can go lol
 

RealMFnG

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I’m in exactly the same position but also have no ability to design or modify a design for a PCB

I can build it and maybe diagnose it if it doesn’t work but that’s as far as I can go lol
Link me to a suitable buck convertor.
 

xodaraP

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Another approach would be to make a daughterboard that fits into the pinout of the miniGun. Existing owners can then use it no sweat.

I was thinking this but then came to the conclusion that if it’s more expensive than a traditional arcade PSU (quality USB-C power supplies aren’t cheap) then it was not really going to work

Fully integrated into the board would be the only way for it to make sense and even then it’s still going to be a limited amount of people who would replace a traditional PSU
 

xodaraP

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Here is where I tried this setup on a few boards to see if it would even work. It did

8A1A37D1-15C0-4C74-B233-51AE07BF6C4E.jpeg

3B8DE7C3-D60D-4390-A9CA-1A2DDF87ACA7.jpeg
 
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