Brook Zero Pi help

[64MK]

hey all, i seem to be missing something very obvious because this one escape me (must be lack of sleep)

I've just wired up the joystick on my Viewlix FC to my Brook Zero Pi and it "works" but up/down and left/right seem ... swapped? I don't understand how this is possible as the connector only seems to fit one way (the right way I'd hope?)

 

[Bxbennyg1]

i think you have to rearrange the gate board to fix that issue. i thhink thats what my friend did to his.

 

[jassin000]

The way the Sanwa stick mounts to the control panel (5pin connector facing downwards) means you'll need to rewire the pin connector for the correct orientation.
In other cabs the 5pin connector faces different directions (often times right) thats why no one is saying (just for example) green wire is always UP (because it will depend on orientation).

 

[ekorz]

Is there not room to install the joystick rotated the other way?

 

[jassin000]

i think you have to rearrange the gate board to fix that issue.

That would be WRONG!
AND we know this because official control panel kits sold by Taito feature the Sanwa sticks 5pin connector facing down.

 

[jassin000]

Is there not room to install the joystick rotated the other way?

It isn't installed any other way so sayith Taito (in truth you can rotate the microswitch PCB but again you SHOULDN'T DO THIS because official is 5pin down).
If you use official wire harnesses you'll quickly catch the mistake (UP will only be UP with the 5pin connector facing down).

OP isn't using an official Taito harness, thus he needs to move connections.

 

[64MK]

I still don't understand how this is just wrong. All this is in terms of products is using the Zero Pi + their cable and a generic Sanwa stick that came with my FC, so where is wrong that needs to be fixed, I don't fully understand. Swap green and another color then 2 others to get then swapped back around?

Oi, I got the dang cable to *avoid* doing that and having issues like this.

 

[jassin000]

Oi, I got the dang cable to *avoid* doing that and having issues like this.

I'm telling you in the arcade world their are NO real standards.
You can't *avoid* stuff like re-pinning harnesses and soldering... You wanted to be a part of this world, remember?

In some cabs the stick mounts with the 5pin connector facing a different direction, thus UP isn't always UP.
Get the picture?
Taito decided to mount the stick that way, others (like Sega) didn't.

IF you used a official Taito Vewlix control panel harness you'd see the directions would be correct for the 5pin connector facing down (but no other orientation).
You are NOT using official Taito parts however, so you'll need to bust out the DIY and re-pin that harness.

Probe the joystick PCB with a multimeter in conductivity mode.
You'll notice 4 traces are unique, however 1 trace is present in every microswitch... That is the common ground.
Once you know where ground is, trace that back to the 5pin connector.
Then experiment with mixing one of the 4 remaining wires with ground, that will complete one direction.
Repeat until you've identified all wire colors are the direction, then de-pin the connector rearrange and reinsert.

 

[64MK]

I took out all that before I got started as it isn't relevant here - I was just basing my general instructions on https://akecon.games/en-us/blogs/akecon-blog/brook-cable-guide
And as he said: "All you need to do is plug in the 5-pin cable to the lever."

Now, I completely get "there are no standards" - business as usual, but I don't under HOW or WHY this is wrong in my head to figure out the best way to just fix it.

I'm not disagreeing, I'm simply not there yet

EDIT: What does Taito have to do with Brook and Sanwa is what I don't get.

 

[64MK]

Is there not room to install the joystick rotated the other way?

Re-reading this I think made me understand this (damn dyslexia) - so I just need to re-install the joystick? Thanks, Taito.

 

[jassin000]

WHY this is wrong in my head to figure out the best way to just fix it

Probe the joystick PCB with a multimeter in conductivity mode.
You'll notice 4 traces are unique, however 1 trace is present in every microswitch... That is the common ground.
Once you know where ground is, trace that back to the 5pin connector.
Then experiment with mixing one of the 4 remaining wires with ground, that will complete one direction.
Repeat until you've identified all wire colors and the direction, then de-pin the connector rearrange and reinsert.

 

[64MK]

Yeah, I get it now. I just couldn't visualize it before. Now I do disagree and will just rotate it.

Edit: I think...

 

[jassin000]

What does Taito have to do with Brook and Sanwa is what I don't get.

Taito uses Sanwa sticks, they mounted them the way they wanted, which means its not directly compatible with other wire harnesses.
Taito don't care, they made the cab so they can wire it any way they see fit.

Sega uses Sanwa sticks, they mounted them the way they wanted, which means its not directly compatible with other wire harnesses.
Sega don't care, they made the cab so they can wire it any way they see fit.

Brooks has NOTHING to do with any of these companies.
They wanted to include a easy pin connector so people could drop this PCB into an arcade machine.
BUT... What wire harness to support (as they are both different)?
I think Brooks picked Sega style (but I'm not sure because I'm an arcade gamer thus I'd never use a Brooks).

 

[64MK]

Yeah, that makes sense now. I couldn't understand how Taito played into the equation at all as this was a Brook+Sanwa... but yeah, position ... heh.

 

[jassin000]

Now I do disagree and will just rotate it.

I know you can't understand all the reasons behind it right now (and others will tell you all kinds of conflicting things) but I highly recommend you work with Taito's design rather then fight it.
ie DON'T ROTATE IT!

 

[64MK]

Depending on how you look at it, rotating it IS working within Taito's design

 

[jassin000]

Depending on how you look at it

I'm locked out of my imgur account atm so I can't show you...
But soon as I get back in I'll show you a stock/complete two player panel directly from Taito.
Both player1 and 2 Sanwa sticks are mounted PCB 5pin connector facing down.

 

[64MK]

I don't think you're lying. I was just trying to wrap my brain around the issue - I have learning disabilities which make it hard for me to understand very visual things if I can't visualize them and for some reason this was one.

With that said, I've addressed the issue for now thanks to @Bxbennyg1's suggestion which I now fully understand. Please don't take that to mean I think you're wrong, I just want to move on and work on more important things for now.

 

[thomas3184]

I assume this came with sfv harness and you just stripped it all out so you aren’t using the vewlix j/k/g harnesses?

The only reason you would want to keep the 5 pin pointing down is if you are using the stock harnesses. If you are using the vewlix as a shell, by all means just rotate the 5 pin up.

 

[64MK]

I assume this came with sfv harness and you just stripped it all out so you aren’t using the vewlix j/k/g harnesses?

The only reason you would want to keep the 5 pin pointing down is if you are using the stock harnesses. If you are using the vewlix as a shell, by all means just rotate the 5 pin up.

100% correct. I won't have use for my TTX4 until I can get FastIO going, until then I'm just running it straight PC.

 

[thomas3184]

100% correct. I won't have use for my TTX4 until I can get FastIO going, until then I'm just running it straight PC.

I think I explained before, but ttx4 doesn’t have fastio input. If you are trying to run a taito fast io then you would definitely not want to rotate your sanwa plate and need standard harnesses.

If you are just running a multi on your ttx4, then use the brooks you have and use joy2key.

Of course you don’t need a ttx4 at all and can install the multi on the computer you have there and sell the ttx4 as well.

 

[jassin000]

I won't have use for my TTX4 until I can get FastIO going

BUT the fact that you WANT to get one going eventually!
That's why you stick with the standard for your cab as set by Taito.

Above: the official Taito VLX wireharness I was searching for (not a home-made solution).
Came on/with the official 2Player Kit (no longer offered for sale).

Both sides/player sticks are mounted down, and the harness is pin'd for a stick in this orientation (down).
Using it will keep with the J/K Taito standard...

That will keep the Taito connector (left side of this image)...

For easy p'np to any ARCADE IO (like the Fast IO) you want to get going.
Hell even Pxlmod's fantastic Sega JVS IO adapter kit uses it.

 

[jassin000]

definitely not want to rotate your sanwa plate and need standard harnesses.

That ^

People are all too happy gutting machines for short term goals, only to regret it later.
You might be thinking "I'll never use X" and that might be 100% true/unchanged.
Its the resale value of the machine which drops considerably.

For lots this hobby is an investment, having the option to bail should things/life go bad (at a profit sometimes) is a nice parachute.

 

[64MK]

Tons of good info here. @Primetrib might wanna check this out.