Exchange_Selects
Beginner
On the hunt for a RPI or PC setup for my Astro city
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mattsoft
Professional
You will either need to obtain the pieces separately and then put it together, or wait for someone to offload a complete kit. Like most hobbies, you will need to be ready to roll up your sleeves and do some work yourself on these things. In the meantime, google "naomi netdimm" and read more about it. It's an amazing piece of kit and will get you a multi-game setup for Naomi that is pretty much unrivaled.
dos
Champion
this looks like it fits the bill, but it uses CF cards and you will have to rewrite the CF card for each game: https://www.ebay.com/itm/354192374783
This one uses an RPI to select the games, but does nto come with a Naomi mainboard: https://www.ebay.com/itm/354201633907
Neither of these comes with a JAMMA I/O, which you need to run it in your Astro. I don't know enough about what's good and bad in that department, so it would be a good idea to start a thread in the Naomi forum expaining exactly what you want to do. Plenty of helpful people there. I guarantee once you have this setup running, you will not think of emulation again.
This one uses an RPI to select the games, but does nto come with a Naomi mainboard: https://www.ebay.com/itm/354201633907
Neither of these comes with a JAMMA I/O, which you need to run it in your Astro. I don't know enough about what's good and bad in that department, so it would be a good idea to start a thread in the Naomi forum expaining exactly what you want to do. Plenty of helpful people there. I guarantee once you have this setup running, you will not think of emulation again.
Sp33dFr34k
Champion
Unfortunately, I feel like Astro City just isn't really great for 480i/p and JVS games like NAOMI. Usability wise, there will be lots of compromise. You're either forced to 480i, which doesn't look great on the MS9, or you're relying on downscaling or emulation to force 240p. 240p means you're forced to throw screen info out, so stuff like text and other details of the game will look bad, and downscaling will add either additional cost, input lag, or both.
I doubt how good emulation can be, since the most popular option seems to be Flycast, which is based of the defunct Reicast project. Others can chime in on this regarding whether I'm right or wrong if they've done the legwork on NAOMI/DC comparison to real hardware. The only stuff I've seen/heard so far is some Fightcade online related play, where there's a general sentiment among serious players that the NAOMI experience isn't as good as other systems available on Fightcade. <-- I haven't personally tried online NAOMI this myself, and I'm not a hardcore MvC2/CvS2 guy, so you can mostly treat this comment as hearsay.
If you go with real hardware, you will need I/O conversion from JVS to JAMMA, which adds cost and lag. Capcom I/O is probably the most popular option, and that will easily cost $200 after shipping, maybe more. That'll be in addition to the NAOMI board, a compatible PSU, the correct Netdimm, and a Raspi (plus LCD) or CF setup, all of which gets very clunky when combined. I own the whole shebang, and while I do enjoy it a lot, the full NAOMI setup is easily the most inconvenient arcade game in my collection.
If you're a competitive MvC2 player, a Dreamcast with a low lag monitor is probably the most space and cost effective way for a well performing setup. In a way, it's also more accurate for USA style MvC2 since Sanwa/Seimitsu+Astro City layout was unusual (or nonexistent?) back in the day. If you're absolutely committed to playing NAOMI on an Astro City, then keep in mind the compromises and the additional work/learning/money you will need to do to make this happen. It could be a time consuming and expensive endeavor, but that comes with the territory of this hobby, and you'll at least come out the other side having learned a lot.
EDIT: A bit off topic, but if you happen to go the real NAOMI route with a Raspi, you will at least also gain access to the Atomiswave library. That means, among many other great games, you get to play Hotuko no Ken. This game is graphically beautiful, and hilariously busted to a point where I consider it as fighting game comedy. Highly recommended.
I doubt how good emulation can be, since the most popular option seems to be Flycast, which is based of the defunct Reicast project. Others can chime in on this regarding whether I'm right or wrong if they've done the legwork on NAOMI/DC comparison to real hardware. The only stuff I've seen/heard so far is some Fightcade online related play, where there's a general sentiment among serious players that the NAOMI experience isn't as good as other systems available on Fightcade. <-- I haven't personally tried online NAOMI this myself, and I'm not a hardcore MvC2/CvS2 guy, so you can mostly treat this comment as hearsay.
If you go with real hardware, you will need I/O conversion from JVS to JAMMA, which adds cost and lag. Capcom I/O is probably the most popular option, and that will easily cost $200 after shipping, maybe more. That'll be in addition to the NAOMI board, a compatible PSU, the correct Netdimm, and a Raspi (plus LCD) or CF setup, all of which gets very clunky when combined. I own the whole shebang, and while I do enjoy it a lot, the full NAOMI setup is easily the most inconvenient arcade game in my collection.
If you're a competitive MvC2 player, a Dreamcast with a low lag monitor is probably the most space and cost effective way for a well performing setup. In a way, it's also more accurate for USA style MvC2 since Sanwa/Seimitsu+Astro City layout was unusual (or nonexistent?) back in the day. If you're absolutely committed to playing NAOMI on an Astro City, then keep in mind the compromises and the additional work/learning/money you will need to do to make this happen. It could be a time consuming and expensive endeavor, but that comes with the territory of this hobby, and you'll at least come out the other side having learned a lot.
EDIT: A bit off topic, but if you happen to go the real NAOMI route with a Raspi, you will at least also gain access to the Atomiswave library. That means, among many other great games, you get to play Hotuko no Ken. This game is graphically beautiful, and hilariously busted to a point where I consider it as fighting game comedy. Highly recommended.
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Exchange_Selects
Beginner
waiwainl
Professional
I too have a rgb-pi and there are many other PI -> Jamma solutions. It works fine, no problem with lag for the most time (some games are simply not emulated well) for casual users. Heck, even the MiSTER project has a JAMMA solution these days.
I do agree with @Zepherino that (New) Astro City is not very well suited for anything above 240p - I did for a while run an XBox360 via SCART -> JAMMA (http://etim.net.au/scart2arcV20_orders/orders.htm) but the interlaced drove me crazy.
So forget about Naomi & 480i/p on your beautiful cab and go for the games that truly were made for that monitor.
PI solution is cheap.
PC solution can stay cheap, as most games do not need much horsepower. Hence any 2nd hand PC setup might do. The thing you need to invest time into is to get it to 15khz (as mentioned earlier in this thread) - J-PAC worked fine for me (until I discovered the real PCB's
)
I do agree with @Zepherino that (New) Astro City is not very well suited for anything above 240p - I did for a while run an XBox360 via SCART -> JAMMA (http://etim.net.au/scart2arcV20_orders/orders.htm) but the interlaced drove me crazy.
So forget about Naomi & 480i/p on your beautiful cab and go for the games that truly were made for that monitor.
PI solution is cheap.
PC solution can stay cheap, as most games do not need much horsepower. Hence any 2nd hand PC setup might do. The thing you need to invest time into is to get it to 15khz (as mentioned earlier in this thread) - J-PAC worked fine for me (until I discovered the real PCB's
)
Sp33dFr34k
Champion
It does, but as stated before, it's not 100%...
mattsoft
Professional
I have a Pi4 and RGB-PI as well and while it "runs" Naomi, it's only 15KHz (e.g., flickerville) and it's laggy and skips frame. The Pi4 just isn't fast enough. Maybe if you overclock the heck out of the Pi4 it would be better. But it's not a great experience. The RGB-PI is fantastic for older games though.
Long story short, the only way to run naomi and have a good time is to run naomi properly and at 31khz. Like it was meant to be.
Sp33dFr34k
Champion
True. But on a NAC you normally don't have a 31khz option. I don't think 480i is that terrible with a decent Jamma/JVS IO. Another option is downscaling 480P to 384P with the Ultracade UVC. That last option I still need to explore myself.
480i isn't as bad as everyone makes it out to be. It's playable, that's for sure. Not as good as 480p, but at the same time not "awful".
A lot of games on console, PS2 era were 480i and considered to look "amazing" for the time.
A lot of games on console, PS2 era were 480i and considered to look "amazing" for the time.
480i is a super personal preference thing. Been running TGM3 on a Neo Candy with a TTX1 lately at 480i and it's okay, but bugs some people more than others. I don't hate it, but I don't love it either. I would call it fine, but less than ideal if you have other options. 100% playable though, imo.
End of the day do whatever makes you happy. I don't care if you play laggy emulation if you don't notice, or whatever else is good enough for you. It's supposed to be fun to do this stuff, not something people yell at you about. But anyone who knows MvC2 combos is going to feel frustrated that they aren't working because of lag. Just something to be aware of.
If you're going to ask for advice here people are going to tell you the proper way to do it, up to you what you do with that advice. MvC2 on a RPi especially is going to be ass, unless you really don't play the game and have no sensitivity to how it's supposed to feel. And an Astro City just isn't a great Naomi home. You can do it with a little effort and compromise though. And MvC2 can look great on it.
End of the day do whatever makes you happy. I don't care if you play laggy emulation if you don't notice, or whatever else is good enough for you. It's supposed to be fun to do this stuff, not something people yell at you about. But anyone who knows MvC2 combos is going to feel frustrated that they aren't working because of lag. Just something to be aware of.
If you're going to ask for advice here people are going to tell you the proper way to do it, up to you what you do with that advice. MvC2 on a RPi especially is going to be ass, unless you really don't play the game and have no sensitivity to how it's supposed to feel. And an Astro City just isn't a great Naomi home. You can do it with a little effort and compromise though. And MvC2 can look great on it.