ShootTheCore
Legendary
Just curious ... is there any arcade Naomi games that didn't get a port to the Dreamcast? I'd like to be excited about a future Darksoft Naomi Multi, but I already have a GDROM-USB SD for my Dreamcast.
So whats next on the list of multis?
- Thread starter Derick2k
- Start date
J
jassin000
Jambo! Safari is one of my arcade faves for Naomi that never made it home.
Also one further point before I stfu (I promise) about the "it's good enough" mentality poison...
Why did we even ask Darksoft to make a MVS Neo-Geo multicart?
After all we have a ton of (161/150/130/120/etc/etc) X-In-One carts, the NeoSD and even conversions.
They all "worked" didn't they?
Ok done, out of my system.
400$ for the naomi multi sounds like fine. I just need to sell my updated netdimm, my collection of naomi PSUs and my two fully configured plug and play Raspberrys with display.... And in return I get the Naomi multi and plenty free space I my room
Attaboy! Always seeing the possitive side of the story that I didnt even think of400$ for the naomi multi sounds like fine. I just need to sell my updated netdimm, my collection of naomi PSUs and my two fully configured plug and play Raspberrys with display.... And in return I get the Naomi multi and plenty free space I my room
I would dump a whole bunch of gear if you made a naomi flash cart. Make it!!!!!!!!!!!!! I need to clear some spaceAttaboy! Always seeing the possitive side of the story that I didnt even think of400$ for the naomi multi sounds like fine. I just need to sell my updated netdimm, my collection of naomi PSUs and my two fully configured plug and play Raspberrys with display.... And in return I get the Naomi multi and plenty free space I my room
streetfighterken
Grand Master
I agree with the sentiment, but from a business perspective, it's not that simple. DS is a limited resource. In software development, we call it "agile". Get to market with something "good enough", then iterate. It's what moves business forward and allows you to build something great. If you slave away forever making one thing "perfect", you'll go bankrupt. If you want it quicker, invest in DS to hire more devs.
So I did some rough ROM counts for the systems that people have mentioned here (these are in no way precise counts, just rough estimates)
Obviously when people opt to buy these multis it becomes a value proposition... is the price tag of a multi setup worth it to get the games I want to play? Obviously a system like a Cave1000 , even with a small library is worth it because of the high cost and desirability of the games, where other systems with a lot more games might only have a small number of titles that people are interested in. BUT a larger catalog means it has greater potential to interest a wider array of people, and the value proposition goes up with the catalog size since you're getting more games for your money.
In any case here are the rough library sizes. Please correct me if I'm way off base on some of these.
Existing/In Development DS Multis:
170+ SNK Neo-Geo MVS/AES
60+ Sega ST-V
45+ Capcom System II
45+ Data East Deco Casette System
35+ Taito F3
20+ Sega Lindbergh Yellow/Lindbergh Red
6+ Capcom System III
Systems mentioned in this thread for potential Multis:
195+ Sega NAOMI/NAOMI2/Atomiswave
75+ Namco System 10/11/12
55+ Nintendo Playchoice 10 (+1000 if including NES titles, then again, does an Everdrive work on this?)
55+ Nintendo Vs.
55+ Namco System 246/256
40+ Sega RingEdge/RingWide/RingEdge2
40+ Sega System-16
40+ Sega Model 2
35+ Taito G-NET (+25 more if including other Sony ZN boards)
30+ Sammy Atomiswave
30+ Capcom System I
30+ IGS PGM
25+ Sega Model 3
25+ Midway MCR (many board variants, most only have <5 per board, so...)
25+ Namco System 2
20+ Namco System 1
20+ IT 32-Bit
20+ Sega System 32
19+ Toaplan type 2
18+ CAVE 1000
17+ CAVE 68000
17+ Konami GX
16+ Psykio SH2
15+ Kaneko Super Nova
13+ Irem M92
10+ Sega System 18
7+ SNK Hyper Neo-Geo 64
7+ Midway Wolf
6+ Sega Hikaru
Obviously when people opt to buy these multis it becomes a value proposition... is the price tag of a multi setup worth it to get the games I want to play? Obviously a system like a Cave1000 , even with a small library is worth it because of the high cost and desirability of the games, where other systems with a lot more games might only have a small number of titles that people are interested in. BUT a larger catalog means it has greater potential to interest a wider array of people, and the value proposition goes up with the catalog size since you're getting more games for your money.
In any case here are the rough library sizes. Please correct me if I'm way off base on some of these.
Existing/In Development DS Multis:
170+ SNK Neo-Geo MVS/AES
60+ Sega ST-V
45+ Capcom System II
45+ Data East Deco Casette System
35+ Taito F3
20+ Sega Lindbergh Yellow/Lindbergh Red
6+ Capcom System III
Systems mentioned in this thread for potential Multis:
195+ Sega NAOMI/NAOMI2/Atomiswave
75+ Namco System 10/11/12
55+ Nintendo Playchoice 10 (+1000 if including NES titles, then again, does an Everdrive work on this?)
55+ Nintendo Vs.
55+ Namco System 246/256
40+ Sega RingEdge/RingWide/RingEdge2
40+ Sega System-16
40+ Sega Model 2
35+ Taito G-NET (+25 more if including other Sony ZN boards)
30+ Sammy Atomiswave
30+ Capcom System I
30+ IGS PGM
25+ Sega Model 3
25+ Midway MCR (many board variants, most only have <5 per board, so...)
25+ Namco System 2
20+ Namco System 1
20+ IT 32-Bit
20+ Sega System 32
19+ Toaplan type 2
18+ CAVE 1000
17+ CAVE 68000
17+ Konami GX
16+ Psykio SH2
15+ Kaneko Super Nova
13+ Irem M92
10+ Sega System 18
7+ SNK Hyper Neo-Geo 64
7+ Midway Wolf
6+ Sega Hikaru
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J
jassin000
One of the best damn movies of all time, think I might watch it again tonight
PascalP
Legendary
I would get rid of my netdimm setup and buy a Naomi flash cart as soon as I could
streetfighterken
Grand Master
I actually am perfectly satisfied with the current piforce 1-SD-card-per-game solution. I don't play the entire library. And if I do want to play an odd game, it's easy enough to write a card for it. I wouldn't want DS to waste time on it when there's so many other platforms with no solution at all.
xodaraP
Legendary
Much as I agree with jassin that the NAOMI solution is far from perfect - it's annoying to set up, even more annoying to keep running (most times you turn it on it's likely to have another issue). But it does work, it does play all the games in the library including the Atomiswave library and as long as you have a good power supply it will boot properly 9 times out of 10
The Neo Geo had plenty of multi carts before the NeoSD/Darksoft Multi, but the emulation was nowhere near perfect. They have issues due to their cheap design and there were many games not included on any of the multi carts, not to mention that to even play everything included on the multi boards, you need to own several of them.
The CPS1 is one of the most well known and well loved platforms ever made, likewise the CPS2 and Neo, so it would make sense to see a multi for it. However I do also believe it's a difficult challenge given the hardware has a high rate of failure to which no solution has been found (the A board custom)
The F3 is a great platform that was sadly less known than it should have been, and it's great to have a multi to demonstrate what people were missing out on to showcase the amazing library that it has.
A CV1000 or Cave multi in general is a great idea given the love that the games have and the humungous cost of the boards
I personally would love to see a System 16 multi just because I love the games on the platform - but equally I would love a CPS1 multi or a Midway Wolf multi.
The Neo Geo had plenty of multi carts before the NeoSD/Darksoft Multi, but the emulation was nowhere near perfect. They have issues due to their cheap design and there were many games not included on any of the multi carts, not to mention that to even play everything included on the multi boards, you need to own several of them.
The CPS1 is one of the most well known and well loved platforms ever made, likewise the CPS2 and Neo, so it would make sense to see a multi for it. However I do also believe it's a difficult challenge given the hardware has a high rate of failure to which no solution has been found (the A board custom)
The F3 is a great platform that was sadly less known than it should have been, and it's great to have a multi to demonstrate what people were missing out on to showcase the amazing library that it has.
A CV1000 or Cave multi in general is a great idea given the love that the games have and the humungous cost of the boards
I personally would love to see a System 16 multi just because I love the games on the platform - but equally I would love a CPS1 multi or a Midway Wolf multi.
aoiddr
Professional
You know, if an arcade perfect board were possible, aren't we talking more like an ArcadeSD Multicade type deal, but one you can put whatever MAME roms on it that you want and they play perfectly...? Like a non-crappy Pandora's Box.
radirgyman
Enthusiast
Brentradio
Champion
I assume if it were that easy/possible it would have been made already...
I personally LOVE playing games on original hardware and original roms, and would much rather have any multi that does that, than another multibox whatever.
aoiddr
Professional
Yes, and that's why I think any talk of CAVE multi is so weird... to make a CAVE multi, it'd have to be just a generic PCB that loads mame roms as it's impractical to expect something to piggy-back off an actual CAVE PCB due to the escalating costs of those games and the possible risk of damaging the boards. So the only true way to get a CAVE multi is through a Pandora's Box-esque multi-box...and you could just build a superior MAME-based PC and use a JPAC right now (or hook a 360 up to an arcade cab), if all you're wanting is to play every CAVE game that's been dumped/released. I'd like to be surprised, but I personally think a CAVE Multi is a pipe-dream that won't happen for another ten years-ish as technology needs to advance a bit further to make it practical as even the Raspberry Pi 3 isn't powerful enough to handle parts of CAVE's PGM games (like the audio).
But yeah, any other multi... PGM, 246/256, CPS1, System 16, etc... totally, yeah, bring them on.
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radirgyman
Enthusiast
Totally valid. Cave pcb costs are killing me. I must enjoy the feeling of death.
This may have already been discussed, but couldn't CAVE's stuff be pretty much covered by 2 hardward sets? I had thought that the early games were fairly generic 68000 stuff and then DDP DOJ onward was IGS hardware?
-ud
-ud
Not necessarily. a "generic PCB that loads mame roms" like ArcadeSD or Pandora's box is emulation based. but it would be possible to replicate the hardware with appropriate changes. For instance the Reproduction carts and SIMMS that were made for CPS3, only on a larger scale. The the JROC multi is similar to this in that it is a completely new complete PCB but reproduces some of the hardware in an FPGA, this allows the games to be played as accurately as the originals without any emulation and without the original hardware either.
If you can reproduce a cart then why couldn't you reproduce a whole PCB? and if you can reproduce a whole PCB then you can make some changes to incorporate a multi right into it.
YES that would be expensive. but given the cost of CAVE PCBs I think paying a $1000 for a reproduction PCB with multi functionality would still be reasonable. you wouldn't have to hunt down and buy a donor pcb, and you wouldn't have to "ruin" a rare game. even at $1000 it'd still be cheaper than buying a cave 1000 title AND multi hardware that plugged into it.
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