NEOGEO + AES Multigame cartridge - NEW POLL INCLUDED. PLEASE VOTE!

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    • There is a reason why the ST-V and CPS2 kits were developed with jumpers and LCD screens instead on screen menus. It didn't have nothing to see with them being a better solution or people preferring them over a built in menu. It was just easier to make, that's all. Every other flash cart out there has a menu but hey, whatever :)


      \o/.k.
    • If I may throw my thoughts into the pot, I despise the idea of an LCD-based display for game selection. No matter how you swing it, an LCD on a cartridge is nothing but ugly 'flash'. So what if software has to be written? It's not at all difficult to write a basic menu and file system - it could probably be done in just a couple of kilobytes. If you're already writing code to load ROMs and change mappings, it shouldn't be a strain to add a quick-n-dirty frontend. It doesn't even need to be like the SD2SNES or 64Drive - it could be as utterly basic as the Everdrive N8, just a black screen with text. Bits of shiny are nice, but I would opine that most of us value ease of use and pure functionality over stylistic doodads.
      "Kindly do not offend me with your ignorance, for once faced with such, I have precious little aversion to ripping out your kidneys and using them as nunchucks in a valiant, if ultimately hopeless, quest to beat the stupid out of you." - RetroDan™
    • kebrank wrote:

      waiwainl wrote:

      Darksoft wrote:

      Feel free to post. I'll put them all in the first post of this thread.

      At this moment it will Flash memory based, as usual
      Still to be decided if menu based or LCD Panel based (as CPS2)
      Games loaded from microSD into the flashes.
      LCD keeps the card more 'original' feeling.MENU makes the card more functional (and probably a bit cheaper, less HW components)
      Personally I would favor LCD (with autoReset) and not the menu. Main reason: I get forced to actually play the game, instead of getting lured in the ease of giving up and choosing a new game on the screen from the menu. It's not a PC or Console, it's a cab you are using it in!
      I just don't get this. With all the respect, the "original feeling" and "I get forced to actually play the game, instead of getting lured in the ease of giving up and choosing a new game" comments sound like the wishes of a 15 year old that can't control himself. Why the need to bend over and mess with a LCD screen when you can do all that from a menu?. Also, I doubt people with an AES console want a bulky LCD screen on the cart or the side of the console to change the game instead using a built in menu.

      \o/.k.
      That's the difference between console and cabinets ;)
      Will be an interesting pose between MVS and AES. Who knows, perhaps we get both LCD & Menu.
    • Mitsurugi-w wrote:

      Personally I don't want a menu. I don't want this thing to feel or look Chinese-y at all. I personally like the "style" that Darksoft has developed with both the ST-V and CPS2 kits. I will use all of my friend-cred with Darksoft to resist the inclusion of an on-screen menu. Unless there could be a user option to use one or the other, of course.
      I agree with this.

      For me it's more hardware arcade feeling without screen menu like chinese all in 1
    • Please for the love of god make it like the 120/161-in-1 except the list of games comes off a SD card full of ROMs. I have zero interest in another setup like the CPS2 multi. The excruciating slow flash times and separate controller/display make it very frustrating to switch games. If you have to deal with this, IMO it's worse than the existing multicarts.

      There are some things that could be improved upon, but this is the core experience I want in a MVS multi, so getting it right is important. The other stuff is icing.
    • ieure wrote:

      Please for the love of god make it like the 120/161-in-1 except the list of games comes off a SD card full of ROMs. I have zero interest in another setup like the CPS2 multi. The excruciating slow flash times and separate controller/display make it very frustrating to switch games. If you have to deal with this, IMO it's worse than the existing multicarts.

      There are some things that could be improved upon, but this is the core experience I want in a MVS multi, so getting it right is important. The other stuff is icing.
      You will deal with load times regardless because the games will not be able to play off of the SD card. Sorry. If the chinese carts are fine with you then you will not need this kit. We aren't trying to make another xxxx-in-1 cart. My personal CPS2 kit with a good SD cart flashes the largest games in less than 30 seconds. Hardly excruciating.
    • ieure wrote:

      Please for the love of god make it like the 120/161-in-1 except the list of games comes off a SD card full of ROMs. I have zero interest in another setup like the CPS2 multi. The excruciating slow flash times and separate controller/display make it very frustrating to switch games. If you have to deal with this, IMO it's worse than the existing multicarts.

      There are some things that could be improved upon, but this is the core experience I want in a MVS multi, so getting it right is important. The other stuff is icing.
      Never check out the NGCD :P
    • Mitsurugi-w wrote:

      ieure wrote:

      Please for the love of god make it like the 120/161-in-1 except the list of games comes off a SD card full of ROMs. I have zero interest in another setup like the CPS2 multi. The excruciating slow flash times and separate controller/display make it very frustrating to switch games. If you have to deal with this, IMO it's worse than the existing multicarts.

      There are some things that could be improved upon, but this is the core experience I want in a MVS multi, so getting it right is important. The other stuff is icing.
      You will deal with load times regardless because the games will not be able to play off of the SD card. Sorry. If the chinese carts are fine with you then you will not need this kit. We aren't trying to make another xxxx-in-1 cart. My personal CPS2 kit with a good SD cart flashes the largest games in less than 30 seconds. Hardly excruciating.
      hmmm yeah. 'ieure' obviously doesn't understand the technology. thats one of the problems with trying to please 'gamers'.

      the chinese x-in-1 works quickly because all of the games are already 'flashed' into the roms and the menu takes care of selection. with the Darksoft version it'll work like a normal cart where the roms contain only 1 game. to change it requires changing the rom data and that is done by re-flashing.
      the only way to stop the load times is either use SDRAM (which is too expensive to implement and the wait would still be about 10 seconds) or put all of the games into the roms at the beginning which would take an hour. then have a menu to select the game. but then you've just got another x-in-1 so no point even doing it, just buy the x-in-1.
    • I'm not sure why everybody tries to compare this project to the Chinese XXX in 1 carts. Having a menu on the cart has nothing to see with the Chinese carts. It's like saying the cart can't have a shell because the Chinese ones come with one. People wants this cart because the possibility of having all the games and not because the LCD screen or a menu. People are not happy with the Chinese carts because they don't have all the games, it's that simple. I know that making a menu is more challenging, so I understand if Darksoft goes with the LCD or jumpers for this project, but if you look at the costs, a LCD screen is not the best option for the project.
      I thought people were looking for convenience and functionality. Are we choosing a LCD screen over a menu because it looks cool or because it's better? If people want the real arcade feeling then they should buy and play the original cartridges. that's the real thing. Having a menu doesn't mean you can't just boot directly to a game. The cart could also have a switch that allows you to boot directly to the game or just the menu.

      \o/.k.
    • kebrank wrote:



      I thought people were looking for convenience and functionality. Are we choosing a LCD screen over a menu because it looks cool or because it's better? If people want the real arcade feeling then they should buy and play the original cartridges. that's the real thing. Having a menu doesn't mean you can't just boot directly to a game. The cart could also have a switch that allows you to boot directly to the game or just the menu.

      \o/.k.

      I am not necessarily looking for convenience, just to be able to play some games that I am unable to find (or obtain) in the real world.

      Such switch (whether it is HW or SW switch) would be OK compromise.
    • Please just make it convienient like the mega ever drive. Almost instant loading, menu based, with save states. There's no way I would wanna scroll through the whole neo library on a lcd screen. The 161 carts are full of bootlegs and take forever to find a game because they are not alphabetically listed. Missing official games like waku waku 7 and twinkle star sprites. These are the things a new multicart should fix. Why reinvent the wheel if it already rolls, just make it better.
    • spilmer wrote:

      Please just make it convienient like the mega ever drive. Almost instant loading, menu based, with save states. [...] Why reinvent the wheel if it already rolls, just make it better.
      Unfortunately this is not a "just make it like X" situation. While I would much prefer a software menu with support for sub folders (similar to an Everdrive) to an external LCD, I would really be fine either way so long as I can have some way of playing the games I don't yet have or which are hard to track down otherwise.

      I think I mentioned early on in this thread (or maybe the one on KLOV) that the Neo multi would be the hardest to make that would please everyone as everyone is going to want one for fundamentally different reasons and no one cart can make everyone happy. I say we be happy with whatever Darksoft can give us as it will still be better than what is already out there (read: Nothing, or the Chinese multi carts...which are basically nothing). If anyone here thinks they can do better, then I challenge you to do so. If you don't have the know how to do it, then either stop whining or hire someone to do it for you (this is not directed at you, spilmer, just a general statement).

      Who knows, maybe in another 5 years we'll see new technology that makes making these sorts of things so easy and cheap that anyone can do it. Until then, Darksoft is our guy. The few times a project like this has been started, it's fallen flat almost immediately either due to complexity or cost or both. If Darksoft can make his idea work, and work reasonably well, then he'll have succeeded (in my mind) where many have failed. And if he can come in close to his quoted price point, he's already at almost half of what others have quoted over the years (I recall anywhere from $600 to $1000). Even Krikzz quoted around $500 minimum for an AES Everdrive, most likely board only.

      This is an exciting thing to see and a great time to be a Neo fan. We may yet see a Neo Everdrive some day, but for now, this is the first step to something amazing :thumbsup:
    • spilmer wrote:

      Please just make it convienient like the mega ever drive. Almost instant loading, menu based, with save states. There's no way I would wanna scroll through the whole neo library on a lcd screen. The 161 carts are full of bootlegs and take forever to find a game because they are not alphabetically listed.

      hmmm yes you make a good point about the large number of Neogeo games.
      it would be hell inconvenient to select a game with the LCD. in fact really painful!
      I have an Everdrive cart and yes it's pretty nice and quick to select games.
      ok, so I guess Darksoft will need to change his game plan and make a simple text menu like the Everdrive cart that loads on boot-up.
      perhaps if player 1 start is pressed at power-on it loads the menu and if no button is pressed it loads the existing flashed game.
      we would need a way within a game to get back to the menu too and cycling the power is unacceptable in my book.
      perhaps holding player 1 start for 5 seconds could do it.
    • What is this place?! A wish farm?! I cannot believe that these awesome project are being made and realized. Never have I imagined that I will be playing arcade games at home. Of course, it's too bad that arcades do not exist anymore like during the 80s, 90s maybe in Asia but not in the rest of the world. If this Multicart is being made most likely the PGM Multicart can be realized, too. You guys are amazing. I need to learn about soldering and circuitry, too? Where should I start?
    • While I've made my own wishes clear (ie, a software game selection menu a la Everdrive), it occurs to me to wonder:

      What is the benefit, if any, of having an LCD screen in this instance? Maybe I'm just a pessimist by nature, but using an LCD screen as a method to select your games seems to only cause problems with the way I think:

      1) More power draw. Flash carts already tend to draw much more power as compared to a standard game.
      2) Component cost. While LCDs aren't really that expensive, if shells are provided, there's going to be an additional labor cost as well to cut the LCD slot out of the plastic.
      3) Game selection. If we're forced to use the LCD to choose the game to flash, that means that changing games requires getting off of my pasty fat ass and physically going to the console to push my way through a 1 or 2 line menu. Not only tedious, but simply being forced into doing this every time would be an active annoyance. Gaming for me is recreational, and this would be pretty obnoxious.
      4) Aesthetics. I have this awful mental image of a NEO-GEO cart with a neon-blue LCD just...shining while I'm trying to play Metal Slug X. Personally, I think it would be distracting, and I think it would look very ugly. Sue me, I want my flash carts to look NICE.

      But my question is not rhetorical. Seriously - what is the benefit of having an LCD screen for game selection?
      "Kindly do not offend me with your ignorance, for once faced with such, I have precious little aversion to ripping out your kidneys and using them as nunchucks in a valiant, if ultimately hopeless, quest to beat the stupid out of you." - RetroDan™
    • RetroDan wrote:

      While I've made my own wishes clear (ie, a software game selection menu a la Everdrive), it occurs to me to wonder:

      What is the benefit, if any, of having an LCD screen in this instance? Maybe I'm just a pessimist by nature, but using an LCD screen as a method to select your games seems to only cause problems with the way I think:

      1) More power draw. Flash carts already tend to draw much more power as compared to a standard game.
      2) Component cost. While LCDs aren't really that expensive, if shells are provided, there's going to be an additional labor cost as well to cut the LCD slot out of the plastic.
      3) Game selection. If we're forced to use the LCD to choose the game to flash, that means that changing games requires getting off of my pasty fat ass and physically going to the console to push my way through a 1 or 2 line menu. Not only tedious, but simply being forced into doing this every time would be an active annoyance. Gaming for me is recreational, and this would be pretty obnoxious.
      4) Aesthetics. I have this awful mental image of a NEO-GEO cart with a neon-blue LCD just...shining while I'm trying to play Metal Slug X. Personally, I think it would be distracting, and I think it would look very ugly. Sue me, I want my flash carts to look NICE.

      But my question is not rhetorical. Seriously - what is the benefit of having an LCD screen for game selection?
      I'm going to make a prediction here.
      I predict if the Darksoft Multi-game Neogeo cart solely uses an LCD so people have to manually access a list of over 160 games it will fail.....