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Cave CV1000-D bootlegs a hoy

Well if we're throwing fun facts about Yagawa now, here's one: YGW used to be on a dev team under Ken Lobb (Killer Instinct creator) for NES games. Said dev team made Recca '92 Summer Carnival and some of its gameplay elements can be seen in Ibara.
 
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600 dollar multi is probably far off it never. The fact the market is selling out of 1000+ "conversion" boards the price is already solidified for now on that stuff. If a multi came out right now they would probably list it for 2000 or slightly more just my thoughts
 
GeekMan1222 said:
600 dollar multi is probably far off it never. The fact the market is selling out of 1000+ "conversion" boards the price is already solidified for now on that stuff. If a multi came out right now they would probably list it for 2000 or slightly more just my thoughts
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And we'd all pay that for a multi probably...
 
We are in a niche market. This is a situation that could quickly get interesting for the seller. Ignoring copyright which I rarely do, you'll find an appetite for some number of an item like this when you make it at or near your asking price, but you truly don't know how long and for how many you can keep demand and profit. Pre-orders from people could kind of mitigate this but still, it's unpredictable.

You could sell 10 quickly and then only sell one every few weeks or longer. You could sell enough quickly to be optimistic and buy parts for hundreds and never sell them all. Mind you this is a unique situation where demand is relatively high for a niche item, or so it appears. Time will tell.
 
The fact is this seller is making bootlegs solely focused on the more expensive titles. It's all about the money...they know what they're doing. And none of it is ending up with the original owner/developer which means zero income and zero motivation to make new games.

This chinese bootlegger is well aware of our niche market and community and is bleeding us out of every penny if the can. We are the target. They are not doing us any favours, that would imply giving us a selection of any title or a multi. By creating a fomo and trickling the pcb's out they can keep the price high for a long as possible. If there's a steady stream of them quickly replacing any sold pcb the price will eventually go down. We don't know if there are enough components to make 10 more pcb's or 1000.
 
I'm not in to buy one of these at any point , but find it fasinating that we are now in the world of 1000+ $$$ bootlegs* ( I do find some bootleg boards interesting and think they have a place even these ) but it is definitely being controlled to keep a price up by trickeling them out ,maybe also so as to not get the wrath of Cave on their backs ,(ak is still relatively new and I'm sure under watch in some sense) I'd be sure ebay would ban if cave followed up with them ,not sure about aliexpress if they turned up there . Am i right and only one AK has been sold ?
Like aerobert said if we all knew there was components to make a 1000pcbs would you still be buying in at such a high price , probably not ,the seller could have been sitting on a lot of these components for a very long while also.We got to remember these games didn't always trade as high as they are now and if they turned up ,the bootlegs that is , a few years ago at say 600 we would have thought that was on the high side !
Has anyone had a look on taobao or that to see if any showing up there ?
 
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geotrig said:
Ibut find it fasinating that we are now in the world of 1000+ $$$ bootlegs* ( I do find some bootleg boards interesting and think they have a place even these )
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It's extra complicated since these are borderline cave production quality. It's basically a 1:1 copy without the cave stickers, not comparable to the bootlegs of the 80s and 90s that tried to recreate proprietary hardware with massive 2 layer pcb's that needed your PSU to max out the 5V rail just to boot.

Where does one draw the line? This adds to the perceived value of these bootlegs.

Anyway. I have nothing more to add. I'm just intrigued and fascinated by all of this.
 
aerobert said:
The fact is this seller is making bootlegs solely focused on the more expensive titles. It's all about the money...they know what they're doing. And none of it is ending up with the original owner/developer which means zero income and zero motivation to make new games.

This chinese bootlegger is well aware of our niche market and community and is bleeding us out of every penny if the can. We are the target. They are not doing us any favours, that would imply giving us a selection of any title or a multi. By creating a fomo and trickling the pcb's out they can keep the price high for a long as possible. If there's a steady stream of them quickly replacing any sold pcb the price will eventually go down. We don't know if there are enough components to make 10 more pcb's or 1000.
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That's it in a nutshell and the problem is that they might be wrongly mistaken as an original. Someone unscrupulous could make his own stickers and try to sell it as original.
 
Hopefully some 1000B games eventually become available. Any of the versions of Mushi Futari and Ibara are where it’s at. DFKs, AK, and DS all have nice ports on other platforms already.
 
That's it in a nutshell and the problem is that they might be wrongly mistaken as an original. Someone unscrupulous could make his own stickers and try to sell it as original.
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yeah the 1:1 side complicates these to be fair (outside of the golc connectors) an ibara copy would be complicated o_O , I'm sure someone will ,unknowingly try and sell one as orignal at some point ! so the serial tracking that the guys where doing has some value here in hopefully keeping tabs , at least this guy didn't try and repro the sticker and sell as originals !!
 
aerobert said:
The fact is this seller is making bootlegs solely focused on the more expensive titles. It's all about the money...they know what they're doing. And none of it is ending up with the original owner/developer which means zero income and zero motivation to make new games.
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Cave wasnt gonna make new arcade games anyways. They havent released any new arcade titles in 12 years. There's zero indications that they'd want to do non-mobile games any more.

aerobert said:
This chinese bootlegger is well aware of our niche market and community and is bleeding us out of every penny if the can. We are the target. They are not doing us any favours, that would imply giving us a selection of any title or a multi. By creating a fomo and trickling the pcb's out they can keep the price high for a long as possible. If there's a steady stream of them quickly replacing any sold pcb the price will eventually go down. We don't know if there are enough components to make 10 more pcb's or 1000.
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Yeah I mean, this is much more complicated than the typical bootleg, especially with the legacy part sourcing. Will be interesting to see how many they make, but I hope its a lot :)

geotrig said:
maybe also so as to not get the wrath of Cave on their backs ,(ak is still relatively new and I'm sure under watch in some sense) I'd be sure ebay would ban if cave followed up with them ,not sure about aliexpress if they turned up there .
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Why would they care? There's been Cave bootlegs of the PGM games on ebay for a loooong time. This is not very different from those in terms of legality (yes I know the original games are stand-alone pcbs, not carts, but the cart bootlegs are still illegal copies).
Akai Katana came out 14 years ago. Thats not new.

Darksoft said:
That's it in a nutshell and the problem is that they might be wrongly mistaken as an original. Someone unscrupulous could make his own stickers and try to sell it as original.
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I mean this is already a problem when buying cart-based arcade stuff. Look at Atomiswave or whatever.
It's a problem, but nothing new, and at least so far, these are easier to identify than cart bootlegs. (Different silkscreen, edge connector, different vias...)



Basically, the thing that makes these new ones more controversial is that they're using some sort of reverse engineered gerbers of the original hardware... but I mean, bootlegs/repros/conversions are illegal copies even without this, so it's not like its THAT much more problematic.

I dunno, it's just cool that more people can play these games as they were intended.
 
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I pretty much agree with everything buffi has said. I think it's also worth reminding people as many other have already pointed out, the components used for these are not trivial to source and drives the cost of production up. I know $300 CV1K bootlegs sound like a real good time for everyone, but I'm not seeing how the math adds up for that to be viable for the people producing these boards.

buffi said:
Why would they care? There's been Cave bootlegs of the PGM games on ebay for a loooong time. This is not very different from those in terms of legality (yes I know the original games are stand-alone pcbs, not carts, but the cart bootlegs are still illegal copies).
Akai Katana came out 14 years ago. Thats not new.
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They care so little that they didn't even bother asking for their games to be removed from MAME; MAME only removed them when EXA got the license and then requested that they be removed. Something else to consider here. I don't see them taking action, but would not be surprised if it does end up happening.
 
imbord3rlin3 said:
It's only illegal if u get caught and someone wants to pursue it
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