FS FS:NEO GEO AES SVC Chaos : SNK vs. Capcom by NCI PRE-ORDER (BOOTLEG)

[xb74]

« Paypal F&F only - why is that?«

Because it’s been more than 10 years we do like this in France , people trust us and they’re never disappointed .
for information NCI games are sold in Paris shops since a while , and I personally manage a lot of pre orders on neo geo addicts fb group.
In case you want to pay as PP transaction this is possible as long as you add the fees .

Is there a legitimate business and website behind the operation? If so, prioritising F&F payments feels sketchy to new customers wouldn't you agree?

 

[Kiljon91]

Is there a legitimate business and website behind the operation? If so, prioritising F&F payments feels sketchy to new customers wouldn't you agree?

There’s a legitimate business cause it’s a company and we pay taxes in France but we have no website ( we used to pass by the shops directly before).
We do understand the fact that it can feel sketchy to new customers in US because apparently you do not know NCI but in France we have the 100% trust.
That’s the reason why we could propose to us people to pay as PP transaction and adding fees.

 

[Blio Seri]

but I've yet to see any "damage" caused by the act. Seriously, how many people have you seen say "Hey, my Famicom / Mega Drive died from using an original Everdrive"? OR "a XXX-in-1 multi cart killed my Neo!"?

From my limited understanding on the topic, I feel its more of a risk for the cart itself than the actual console.

It's of course a tricky topic. Yes I did see xxx-in-1 carts or even EDs dying. Was it because of improper voltage shifting? Who knows? Could just be the overall bad quality of the product.
I agree, consoles are rarer, and when it happens can you really blame the cart when the machine is 30+ years old?
That said I'd prefer to play it safe and have voltage translation everywhere it's needed.

 

[urukai]

@Blio Seri @Niko @Darksoft

Hi Guys,

First of all, thank you for your interest in this thread.

Thanks especially to Niko for explaining (much better than me) that the NCI reproductions are of very good quality.

A huge thank you to @Darksoft who makes products for multi that are just the best you can find and for taking the trouble to answer here.

It's a well known problem found very often when shortcuts are made in the design: those old systems use +5V to run their logic chips but a lot of bootleggers actually use +3.3V flashes directly connected to +5V busses, which can damange the cart and the console. The proper way of doing it is to add chips called level-shifters/level-translators, making the conversion between +5V and +3.3V both ways.
The xxx-in-1 carts from china all suffer from this, even some early Everdrives were concerned.
That would be great to have confirmation from NCI and would reassure customers on the quality of the product.
Thanks.

I agree with you 100%

I too want to see all newly designed components using +5v components or proper level shifting of the logic.

With that said I do not know how NCI designs their carts or defending anyone's choices on this matter, but I've yet to see any "damage" caused by the act. Seriously, how many people have you seen say "Hey, my Famicom / Mega Drive died from using an original Everdrive"? OR "a XXX-in-1 multi cart killed my Neo!"?

From my limited understanding on the topic, I feel its more of a risk for the cart itself than the actual console.

It would be cool to see the forum professionals add their point of view. @brizzo @Darksoft how do you guys feel about +3.3v logic devices being used in +5v systems?

I have to agree with this. We put A LOT of level shifters in the multis just for that reason. They make the design more complex and the final product more expensive, but you guarantee the proper working of the system and secure levels both for the cart and the console. Connecting 3.3V devices to a 5V system is very daring and can go wrong in so many ways that we'd need a separate thread just for that.

Atomik who build those reproduction is not on the forum, but here his answer about your questions on voltage and level-shifters. He desire to preserve the material and reproduce cartridges that preserve the original spirit while using more recent technologies. Its goal is really to produce quality cartridges and to have people happy to be able to buy games at more reasonable prices.

Let me explain it: flash chip uses 3.3V, which provides 5V input from neogeo console, then reduces the voltage to 3.3V and provides it to flash chip. flash gets 3.3V, and the level voltage of output io is also 3.3V. However, the slot pin of neogeo is always 5V, and 3.3V is lower than 5V, so it is impossible to cause damage to the console. On the contrary, the 5V of neogeo console will cause damage to the 3.3V chip of PCBA, so I have done a lot of capacitive isolation protection

I hope that this answer will have answered your questions and reassured you on its cartridges.

 

[Blio Seri]

Let me explain it: flash chip uses 3.3V, which provides 5V input from neogeo console, then reduces the voltage to 3.3V and provides it to flash chip. flash gets 3.3V, and the level voltage of output io is also 3.3V. However, the slot pin of neogeo is always 5V, and 3.3V is lower than 5V, so it is impossible to cause damage to the console. On the contrary, the 5V of neogeo console will cause damage to the 3.3V chip of PCBA, so I have done a lot of capacitive isolation protection

Thanks for your answer, but this is still unclear to me as I've never heard of "capacitive isolation", always thought you had to use dedicated chips for voltage translation.
I understand the 3.3V sent back to the console is lower than 5V and is safe, but that could explain the bugs you're experiencing with some motherboard revisions if the signals somehow stay in the grey area (neither deteted as low or high).
Any chance we get a pic of the PCBs or anyone could open their NCI carts?

 

[Niko]

I understand the 3.3V sent back to the console is lower than 5V and is safe, but that could explain the bugs you're experiencing with some motherboard revisions if the signals somehow stay in the grey area (neither deteted as low or high).

I dont think that would be the case if the bugs only presented with the patched ROM.

But yea, on a related note. I dont think anyone would mind spending a few extra bucks to have proper logic level translation in these carts.

 

[Blio Seri]

@Niko I'm not talking about that new SVC Chaos release but this:

Just my two cent from personal experience:

The physical quality of the previous NCI repros I have testes is top notch. However, the main issue I have found with them is that they all had glitches.

The look good on a shelf but most have either graphical issue or sound issues that made the experience annoying to play...

Oh well? On which games did you observe this? Usually it is due to a problem with the power supply.

Did you contact the forum where you bought it? After sales service is guaranteed. If the cartridge has a defect, they send you a new one. It's not to late to do it.

@arcadefanatic56 I just checked with the team. 99,99% it's due to a psu issue, especially if you have the same problem on several games. I can help you solving this issue you have. Just tell me the concerned games, the revision of your AES and the PSU you're using please. It doesn’t have to be much. None of the games sold have glitches.

 

[xb74]

There’s a legitimate business cause it’s a company and we pay taxes in France but we have no website ( we used to pass by the shops directly before).
We do understand the fact that it can feel sketchy to new customers in US because apparently you do not know NCI but in France we have the 100% trust.
That’s the reason why we could propose to us people to pay as PP transaction and adding fees.

There used to be a website right? What happened?

https://www.facebook.com/neoconceptioninternational?mibextid=ZbWKwL

Which shops did you supply to and what are the shop websites? Do you have an ebay store?

You need to come equipped with some evidence/information to back up your claims.

 

[Niko]

@Niko I'm not talking about that new SVC Chaos release but this:

I mean the guy hasn’t been back to give any more information or even mention what games had an issue.

I can only speak to my experience with the two carts I have ( Garou - Grant Edition, and Metal Slug - Perfect Edition ). Neither of which I’ve had had any issues with.

Notice too how the NCI team was quick to offer advice and even the potential for @arcadefanatic56 to have his carts replaced after all this time and with little to no information. They obviously take their quality very seriously. Just my .02 cents

 

[urukai]

There used to be a website right? What happened?

https://www.facebook.com/neoconceptioninternational?mibextid=ZbWKwL

Which shops did you supply to and what are the shop websites? Do you have an ebay store?

You need to come equipped with some evidence/information to back up your claims.

@xb74 Hi !

Unfortunatly I won't have much time before monday to answer with all the info. I can however advise you to look on the Facebook group (https://www.facebook.com/groups/916889379113146/permalink/1492743054861106) which is the main entry point for pre-orders to find all the information you are looking for. Do not hesitate to ask people there in DM or even write a post, as you will have answers from several different people who are not in the Team. You will see that there is a 100% satisfaction of these reproductions.

And sorry for not being able to give you more info here right away.

@Niko I'm not talking about that new SVC Chaos release but this:

@Blio Seri Thank you for your interest in the project and your curiosity. In fact, what has been observed is that on revisions 3.3 it is really important to use a very good power supply. We have a member of the FB group who customizes MEAN WELL medical device PSUs to fit the neogeo (link on another group for more transparency: https://m.facebook.com/groups/158055546139049/permalink/656500459627886/)

I hope I could help

 

[NeoGuile]

Hi, just a little message to tell you that I pre-ordered the SVC CHAOS game on the Neo Geo System forum [NGS]

I've already ordered a NCI game (Sangoku 2) on the same forum and all it's very well, the quality of the copy is just exellent.

 

[urukai]

Hi, just a little message to tell you that I pre-ordered the SVC CHAOS game on the Neo Geo System forum [NGS]

I've already ordered a NCI game (Sangoku 2) on the same forum and all it's very well, the quality of the copy is just exellent.

Thank you very much for your testimony!

 

[kazuo]

I wonder if a high amp Triad would be sufficient for this use case. Hacking a Mean Well seems like overkill to me.

 

[Niko]

I wonder if a high amp Triad would be sufficient for this use case. Hacking a Mean Well seems like overkill to me.

Yea the Triad's supply plenty of power. I went with FirebrandX's recommendations

https://www.firebrandx.com/aespsuguide.html

 

[kazuo]

I also wonder why high amp power supply is necessary for these at all. I can understand a flash cart, with the FPGA and everything else going on in those, but why does a straight "reproduction" of a game require high amp PSU?

 

[Niko]

I also wonder why high amp power supply is necessary for these at all. I can understand a flash cart, with the FPGA and everything else going on in those, but why does a straight "reproduction" of a game require high amp PSU?

A high amp PSU ( in the sense of higher than stock ) isn’t a requirement, I can confirm they work just fine with a stock PSU.

I think the recommendation comes from the fact that these systems and power supplies are ~30yrs old at this point and without a recap of the PSU and potentially the system as well then things probably aren’t performing to spec.

 

[urukai]

Pre-orders will be closed Sunday 15th.

Thanks !

 

[urukai]

PRE-ORDERS ARE CLOSED ! THANKS FOR THOSE WHO PRE-ORDERED !
See you in few weeks for your tracking info !

 

[urukai]

All pre-orders made here are shipped. Tracking numbers were sent to concerned people. Thanks again !

 

[SNK-NEO-GEO]