Taito Vewlix C: to JAMMA and Beyond!

[twistedsymphony]

@jassin000 your GH lag test now has me thinking I should pickup a 360 VGA cable and run it through the various 31K CRTs I have just to see what they say.

On a related note does anyone have any Links or other information related to the FAST I/O? I've really only heard about it in passing but I've never seen what the I/O boards look like or really any other information about them.

 

[SEGASHIRO]

I would be interested in seeing what those CRT results would be...

 

[SNK-NEO-GEO]

Apparently my 360 joystick that I have been using on my PC is a piece of LAG

 

[jassin000]

@jassin000 your GH lag test now has me thinking I should pickup a 360 VGA cable and run it through the various 31K CRTs I have just to see what they say

I'm also very interested to retest the same monitors over again using VGA cable.
I suspect the lag will be reduced accost the board, but I need to verify it.

I know the Rock Band 3 calibration test isn't the best benchmark in the world...
But I'm thinking we (hardcore gamers) should put together our own database with GH3 test results from various gaming displays.
Most of us own 360's, and Rock Band 3 is selling for around 15~20$ now.

 

[twistedsymphony]

I've already got RB3 and a guitar with the sensor... I just placed an order for the VGA cable.

If the CRTs really are "0 lag" then they should register around 14-15ms on the Guitar Hero test, given the difference between your GH test on those monitors and the LB test results from Display lag. 14-15ms would be the lag just from the controller and 360 itself.

 

[twistedsymphony]

while we're on the topic of lag I recently came across this:
http://www.hackmycab.com/?portfolio=usb-polling

I'd never heard of anyone modifying the USB polling rate. I wonder how much of an actual difference it makes.

 

[Derick2k]

So I got the tester today and here are the results on the new lcd all 3 regions tested:


Upper Middle Lower

For comparison, sort of:

Samsung Syncmaster PX2370

Upper Middle

Dell U2414HB

Upper Middle

 

[Derick2k]

I still need to test the original Sanwa panel when I get the hdmi to dvi adapter. I will post pics of those tests when done, but they have to be a lot better than this new panel.

 

[jassin000]

Konami: TMNT (Ocean 2-Player ROMs)

I got a good price on this board because it was being sold as not working/scrambled grafix.
My friend repaired the two damaged/cut traces (red circle 4th picture) and helped with flashing/writing the 2-player ROM set.

 

[SNK-NEO-GEO]

Looks awesome.. And it might be hard to get that type of monitor again, the last time I checked, according to Taito they had '"3" in stock..

 

[Duke]

I had guitar hero 3 (legends of rock) and rock band 1 on hand and I did some lag testing too.

I think it's not very relevant:

- GH3 got me anywhere between 2 and 20 ms
- RB 1 got me 0 all the time ...

I knew these where not accurate but it seems your RB 3 test is somehow better.

If I get my hands on RB3 I'll give it a try or even better the tester you have

Btw does it work by sending a signal to the VGA/DVI port and then calculating how long it takes to light up on the screen ?

 

[jassin000]

Btw does it work by sending a signal to the VGA/DVI port and then calculating how long it takes to light up on the screen ?

Yes thats just how it works...
The game sends a series of bright white flash pulses to the screen, and the optic sensor in the guitar (you have to have the Rockband 2/3 model) measures how quickly it sees them.

Of course as mentioned above by Twisted, its also adding in lag from the wireless controller.
So our figures above are total lag including controller input.
By this logic even a CRT (considered to be 0MS lag) would show some lag just because of the controller interface.

 

[Derick2k]

I found the specification file for the new lcd panels in case anyone wants to read it, its attached. I will be testing the original sanwa display tonight and will post results, I expect them to be about the same as this or maybe better, we will see.

 

[Duke]

Derick,

On what cabinet is this panel used ? P320HVN01.0 ?

is it just the panel or also the signal processing part ?

Also I just realized it's using an LVDS input, so converting hdmi/vgi to LVDS might incur some lag :/
Thanks !

 

[Derick2k]

This panel is used on taito's replacement display for the Vewlix cabs. The original displays on the F & C cabs were from Sanwa. You can see the display in action above on Jassin's post.

 

[Duke]

I see, but P320HVN01.0 is just the panel ? meaning you need another board to actually use it ? (ldvs to hdmi or vga) ?

 

[Derick2k]

Yes, you need the other electronics. I wanted to look up the specs on the specific panel used and compare that to the original sanwa display panel, I am looking that one up now.

Taito hired Alpha Display from Korea to make the displays, they in turn sourced the lcd panel from AU Optronics. Trying to see what these panels are really worth.

 

[Duke]

Thanks for the clarification.

I actually think most of the panel are ok performance/lag wise, I always assumed it's the signal processing part that makes it better/worse.

It's a gut feeling but I wonder if we could test it, if the panels are all using LVDS, may be we could try switching the signal processing part and see how it differs.

For the original Viewlix do you have the reference (if there's any) of the signal processing part ?

 

[Derick2k]

Ok, so I tested the original Sanwa panel from the Vewlix F & C cabs using the DVI connection and here are the results.

Top--------------------------------------------------------------------------Middle--------------------------------------------------------Bottom

Overall slightly better input lag than the new replacement displays which have now been sold/phased out.

I spoke with the Taito rep and they are now in the phase of testing new replacement screens that were commission to replace their current replacement screens which are now basically sold out. SNK-NEO-GEO bought 2 of the last 3 and another person has put a hold on the last one. As SNK stated, the taito rep said there will be more screens available in the future for sale as they are now undergoing Taito's Quality Assurance testing phase before they tell their supplier to ramp up manufacturing. No details/specs yet on the new screens.

Thanks go out to TwistedSymphony for pointing out the Leo Bodnar lag tester, great little tool.

 

[jugu]

Yes, you need the other electronics. I wanted to look up the specs on the specific panel used and compare that to the original sanwa display panel, I am looking that one up now.

Taito hired Alpha Display from Korea to make the displays, they in turn sourced the lcd panel from AU Optronics. Trying to see what these panels are really worth.

Could you use the existing board from the current display and just swap out the panel? This site has that panel for less than $400:
http://www.apollodisplays.com/Products/TFTDisplays/TFTDisplaysAUO