Sega Rally | Sega Rally 2 PCB Question

[kennedypro86]

Hi Everyone,

I'm somewhat new to the hobby, so please forgive if this is a dumb question, but would I be able to swap out a Sega Rally board with a Sega Rally 2? I currently own a Sega Rally twin cabinet and want to swap if it's possible.

SEGA RALLY:

SEGA RALLY 2:

 

[nem]

Sega Rally 2 is Model 3. You need a different power supply (one that has a 3.3V rail) and associated wiring.

So no, not a straight swap.

 

[kennedypro86]

Sega Rally 2 is Model 3. You need a different power supply (one that has a 3.3V rail) and associated wiring.

So no, not a straight swap.

Thanks for the reply. Do you know if the swap would affect the wheel's feedback in any way?

 

[CeceWobbles]

Thanks for the reply. Do you know if the swap would affect the wheel's feedback in any way?

It uses a different type of steering assembly that started with Super GT/Scud Race. There was also the Indy 500 type between. You can get SR2 to run in one side of your twin, but you'll have to acquire a lot of parts, including that steering assembly, but that can be sourced from the more-common Daytona USA 2. The two required drive/feedback boards would also be the same as Daytona 2, just with a different ROM on it. By the way, that $400 board set is way overpriced because that's not even including the required sound board in the smaller metal cage, which they're selling separately for an additional $250.

Being in the US, your best bet would be to acquire a Daytona 2 first since they are far more abundant here. I got lucky and went the opposite way by finding an SR2 twin and then wanting to also play Daytona 2, which just required swapping the FFB controller board (easier to unplug and plug in rather than swapping ROMs) and the sound board. I also had to change one small wiring harness and the mixer setup to get the correct 4-channel speaker output. They just had to make it annoying and output different channels on different lines compared to SR2. Super GT pops up occasionally, but just know that it does use an older sound board, so the wiring would be more work than running SR2 on a Daytona 2 harness since you'd have to get power to and output from the newer style one. Super GT would at least get you all of the necessary controls like Daytona 2 would, and in either case for that, you'd just need someone to pop off a copy of the correct ROM (EPR-20512) for your drive board. You can find some useful info here regarding those control differences: http://superusr.free.fr/model3_fichiers/FFB-Model123.pdf

 

[CeceWobbles]

Here are some Daytona 2 and SR2 pics for reference. Daytona 2's sound board uses an additional harness inside on CN7, which I had to account for (along with the channel differences) outside of that box. To add some more confusing fun, you'll see that the EPROM on my SR2 sound board is 20641. If you look at other sound boards for SR2, you might see 20506. 20506 and the four ROMS with it (20502-20505) will correspond with the earlier DX version like you have pictured above, whereas 20641 and 20637-20640 is for the later/revised version of SR2, which is what my twin has.

 

[DRAGONKZ]

Are there any major changes in the later revisions of SR2 ROMs?

I’ve got a SR2 twin on the way and will check mine now as well, as I never knew there were different ROM versions!

 

[nem]

Thanks for the reply. Do you know if the swap would affect the wheel's feedback in any way?

Feedback wouldn't work, as @CeceWobbles has written. However, there's nothing stopping you from using the Sega Rally steering assembly without feedback.

Biggest obstacle in getting it running is the different PSU.

 

[kennedypro86]

It uses a different type of steering assembly that started with Super GT/Scud Race. There was also the Indy 500 type between. You can get SR2 to run in one side of your twin, but you'll have to acquire a lot of parts, including that steering assembly, but that can be sourced from the more-common Daytona USA 2. The two required drive/feedback boards would also be the same as Daytona 2, just with a different ROM on it. By the way, that $400 board set is way overpriced because that's not even including the required sound board in the smaller metal cage, which they're selling separately for an additional $250.

Being in the US, your best bet would be to acquire a Daytona 2 first since they are far more abundant here. I got lucky and went the opposite way by finding an SR2 twin and then wanting to also play Daytona 2, which just required swapping the FFB controller board (easier to unplug and plug in rather than swapping ROMs) and the sound board. I also had to change one small wiring harness and the mixer setup to get the correct 4-channel speaker output. They just had to make it annoying and output different channels on different lines compared to SR2. Super GT pops up occasionally, but just know that it does use an older sound board, so the wiring would be more work than running SR2 on a Daytona 2 harness since you'd have to get power to and output from the newer style one. Super GT would at least get you all of the necessary controls like Daytona 2 would, and in either case for that, you'd just need someone to pop off a copy of the correct ROM (EPR-20512) for your drive board. You can find some useful info here regarding those control differences: http://superusr.free.fr/model3_fichiers/FFB-Model123.pdf

Thanks for the detailed information. This is very useful. I'll be referencing this for sure.

 

[kennedypro86]

Feedback wouldn't work, as @CeceWobbles has written. However, there's nothing stopping you from using the Sega Rally steering assembly without feedback.

Biggest obstacle in getting it running is the different PSU.

Gotcha. I like the feedback, so I'll have to think about whether or not I should just buy a full SR2 cabinet. Thanks for the info.

 

[CeceWobbles]

Are there any major changes in the later revisions of SR2 ROMs?

I’ve got a SR2 twin on the way and will check mine now as well, as I never knew there were different ROM versions!

This is what I had seen on this page when looking into it before:

The game was produced in three cabinet versions: 1) upright cabinet with 2 player alternating play. This unit does not have multiplayer network ability. 2) Deluxe (DX) version with a sit-down cabinet, an additional handbrake for hairpin turns, and a 50-inch projection screen display. The first released DX has slower cars and different paint on the Toyota and Ford, is a little less polished in graphical terms than the later twin version. The DX has ability for multiplayer network play for up to 4. 3) Twin version with dual sit-down cabinet, handbrake feature, two 29-inch CRTs and some minor improvements to gameplay, features, and sound beyond those of the upright and DX. The twin can display the www.segarally.com text, the DX does not even have the option, but has a nicer motif on the Ford Escort (white/orange). The Twin has ability for multiplayer network play for up to 4.

While it notes the DX version as being tied to the deluxe sit-down motion/projection setup, I have seen Japan-style twin cabs where both sides are running the DX board set. (Mine is a US-style one with glass in front of the monitors.) The current ebay listing for two sets that the pic at the top came from is being sold by someone parting out a Japanese twin. I actually have a DX main board set I still need to test, and I took a gamble on a sound board marked 837-13375 rather than 837-13376 with ROMs 20507-20511 instead of 20502-20506, and it should be here soon. I've seen 837-13375 listed in a PDF of the US manual for the deluxe projection model, so I don't think it's much of a risk, and these are all sequentially before the drive board ROM of 20512, too. I found a twin PDF showing 837-13376, so my guess is that there is some minor difference between the projection model and twin based on the amp/speaker setup. DX rom sets available for emulation all seem to have 20502-20506.

 

[Ringo]

Super GT pops up occasionally, but just know that it does use an older sound board, so the wiring would be more work than running SR2 on a Daytona 2 harness since you'd have to get power to and output from the newer style one.

You can use a DSB1 in a Sega Rally 2/Daytona 2 cabinet with an easy mod.
The sound connectors are the same on both DSB1 and DSB2, just cut off the tab and rotate the serial connector 180 degrees.

When playing Scud Race/Super GT in my SR2 cabinet I use the loom and filterboard from an old DSB2.

 

[CeceWobbles]

You can use a DSB1 in a Sega Rally 2/Daytona 2 cabinet with an easy mod.
The sound connectors are the same on both DSB1 and DSB2, just cut off the tab and rotate the serial connector 180 degrees.

When playing Scud Race/Super GT in my SR2 cabinet I use the loom and filterboard from an old DSB2.

Thanks for the info. I'm glad it will be simple. I don't have that game yet, but would like to grab it at some point since I've already got most of what's needed.

 

[Bay78]

Hey everyone,

I've got a Daytona 2 cab. And I also have a Harley Davidson PCB and also Sega Super GT PCB. I've tried swapping in Harley Davidson in my Daytona 2 and it's almost flawless but has one problem and it makes it unplayable. It mentions to let go of the rear brake to allow the bike to drive. Being a Daytona 2 cab it doesn't have a rear brake. So I'm not sure if it's a steering board issue as I'm running the Daytona 2 board or a wiring issue? And Sega Super GT works but I don't have all the sounds. I board set I bought the guy said it doesn't have music but has all the selection screen , speech and sound effects. What board would have that info? The top rom board? Also I do have the original soundboard for Sega Super GT. Is there any tutorial or anything to help someone with what needs to be done to hook it up in a Daytona 2 cabinet? Any information would be greatly appreciated guys. It's been hard trying to find any information on this.

 

[nem]

Being a Daytona 2 cab it doesn't have a rear brake. So I'm not sure if it's a steering board issue as I'm running the Daytona 2 board or a wiring issue?

Wiring. It's probably an unused analog input on Daytona 2.

You need to look up a schematic.

 

[Bay78]

You can use a DSB1 in a Sega Rally 2/Daytona 2 cabinet with an easy mod.
The sound connectors are the same on both DSB1 and DSB2, just cut off the tab and rotate the serial connector 180 degrees.

When playing Scud Race/Super GT in my SR2 cabinet I use the loom and filterboard from an old DSB2.

Could you post some pictures of the loom that you created to do the swap? I'm wanting to do the same thing in my Daytona 2 cabinet

 

[Ringo]

Could you post some pictures of the loom that you created to do the swap? I'm wanting to do the same thing in my Daytona 2 cabinet

https://www.arcade-projects.com/threads/sega-model-2-3-hacked-romsets.4610/page-2#post-68066

 

[PaulWoodpross3r]

Hey everyone,

I've got a Daytona 2 cab. And I also have a Harley Davidson PCB and also Sega Super GT PCB. I've tried swapping in Harley Davidson in my Daytona 2 and it's almost flawless but has one problem and it makes it unplayable. It mentions to let go of the rear brake to allow the bike to drive. Being a Daytona 2 cab it doesn't have a rear brake. So I'm not sure if it's a steering board issue as I'm running the Daytona 2 board or a wiring issue? And Sega Super GT works but I don't have all the sounds. I board set I bought the guy said it doesn't have music but has all the selection screen , speech and sound effects. What board would have that info? The top rom board? Also I do have the original soundboard for Sega Super GT. Is there any tutorial or anything to help someone with what needs to be done to hook it up in a Daytona 2 cabinet? Any information would be greatly appreciated guys. It's been hard trying to find any information on this.

I have played Harley-Davidson & L.A. Riders in my Scud Race/Lemans cabinet, and you need to short the Rear Brake (CN1, Pin 9) to a ground pin on your filter board. I have shorted this pin to pin 6, CN10 (RS422 port) and the game plays fine, though it is the only Model 3 racing game that does not have force feedback. You can use a Dupont wire to one pin and a crimped NH pin on the other side.

After you short the pin, calibrate ALL of your inputs. Set the steering from 40H to C0H. I have beaten the game with 5 stages on the Normal difficulty using all bikes, and it's actually nice to have a little bonus game in my race cab that can play other masterpieces like Scud Race (the MAIN reason I bought my Lemans cab).

DSB1/DSB2 Sound Board for Scud Race and Daytona 2
I had to tap into my cabinet power supply to get the sound board to work for music, since it wasn't populated. The (internal, not caged) power connector for the DSB1 and DSB2 sound boards are the same (JST-RA I believe), but they are KEYED. So if you plug the original Scud Race sound board connector "properly" (where it snaps in) into a Daytona 2 sound board without the cage, you could potentially fry it so please BE CAREFUL when doing this and pay close attention to your wiring.

I have set my machine up for both DSB1 and DSB2, though my cab doesn't have room for the DSB2 cage, so I run it outside the cage.
If you go this route, I don't exactly recommend doing THE FOLLOWING method since it is a "hack", but:
- I melted the key tab off of a DSB2 power connector, using a janky soldering iron tip that I exclusively use for melting plastic. This has worked quite well because I would bust the plastic connector on my DSB1 slightly if I plugged this connector in "backwards" (aka the 'correct' way). Therefore, I would only recommend this for cabinets that do not use a sound board so be careful if you wish to keep all your connectors and looms original.

If you have any questions with regards to schematics, dm me or let me know. I love messing around with this Model 3 stuff man.

 

[Bay78]

I have played Harley-Davidson & L.A. Riders in my Scud Race/Lemans cabinet, and you need to short the Rear Brake (CN1, Pin 9) to a ground pin on your filter board. I have shorted this pin to pin 6, CN10 (RS422 port) and the game plays fine, though it is the only Model 3 racing game that does not have force feedback. You can use a Dupont wire to one pin and a crimped NH pin on the other side.

After you short the pin, calibrate ALL of your inputs. Set the steering from 40H to C0H. I have beaten the game with 5 stages on the Normal difficulty using all bikes, and it's actually nice to have a little bonus game in my race cab that can play other masterpieces like Scud Race (the MAIN reason I bought my Lemans cab).

DSB1/DSB2 Sound Board for Scud Race and Daytona 2
I had to tap into my cabinet power supply to get the sound board to work for music, since it wasn't populated. The (internal, not caged) power connector for the DSB1 and DSB2 sound boards are the same (JST-RA I believe), but they are KEYED. So if you plug the original Scud Race sound board connector "properly" (where it snaps in) into a Daytona 2 sound board without the cage, you could potentially fry it so please BE CAREFUL when doing this and pay close attention to your wiring.

I have set my machine up for both DSB1 and DSB2, though my cab doesn't have room for the DSB2 cage, so I run it outside the cage.
If you go this route, I don't exactly recommend doing THE FOLLOWING method since it is a "hack", but:
- I melted the key tab off of a DSB2 power connector, using a janky soldering iron tip that I exclusively use for melting plastic. This has worked quite well because I would bust the plastic connector on my DSB1 slightly if I plugged this connector in "backwards" (aka the 'correct' way). Therefore, I would only recommend this for cabinets that do not use a sound board so be careful if you wish to keep all your connectors and looms original.

If you have any questions with regards to schematics, dm me or let me know. I love messing around with this Model 3 stuff man.

Thank you very much, I love messing around as well. But I’m finding there is so little information out there for making multiple of these games work in a single cabinet which is my dream. I’ll look into the Harley situation first and also the Sega Super GT PCB I bought that only has background sound. Is all the sounds on the rom board? I have a spare not working Sega Super GT PCB but the rom board works. So I’m going to try and swap the rom boards and see what happens. I understand it will still be missing sounds until I get the DSB thing figured out but yeah I’m excited to get it done.