Converting GDROM NAOMI games to cart.

[twistedsymphony]

not sure why anyone else can't do this as well, too lazy/stupid probably.

...brutal...

 

[zero238]

not sure why anyone else can't do this as well, too lazy/stupid probably.

we are simple people with a selfish desire to play games the easy way. Everytime i read these amazing things that can be done, it's almost like they talk in a different language.

 

[skate323k137]

It can take 2-3 minutes to load a game, but once loaded....zero wait time. Is that what you are asking

The reason they want it on CART is so that they can use a Capcom I/O without a JVS power supply... the DIMM boards draw too more 3.3V power than the converter in the Capcom I/O supplies so it means they have to run a dedicated SUN PSU (or similar) instead of a normal PSU through the JAMMA harness.
PERSONALLY I'm going to go against the grain here and say that I think it would be a waste of time. there are many decent multi-boot options on NAOMI already one would have to be a lot cheaper/faster/easier to use to be worth using instead. Meanwhile there are many other multi-game systems without a multi-boot option; seems foolish to add ANOTHER one for NAOMI.

You of course should work on whatever you want to work on... that's just my 2 cents.

looking into the supposed mod for a capcom IO to provide enough 3.3v to eliminate the need for an extra PSU

The problem isn't the Capcom I/O, the problem is that the limited power that can be drawn from a 15Watt JAMMA PSU and through the skimpy wires in most JAMMA harnesses doesn't even give the Capcom I/O enough to work with. Not to mention there are half as many output wires so you have another bottleneck there.
Honestly, if people are so hell-bent on not using a JVS PSU just buy one of those Meanwell 3.3V PSU I listed here: List Retail ATX PSU that works with your NAOMI 1 and/or 2. it's $17 and should supplement a JAMMA PSU just fine, hell it's small enough you could bolt it to the top of the Capcom I/O if you're worried about it taking up too much space.

I'm with you completely on the going against the grain here. The NAOMI may not be the easiest thing but it's easy enough and the whole game library is playable already.

In regards to the Capcom IO I don't think the limiting factor is the PSU powering it. I've hooked one up to a nice meanwell 5v/12v supply with plenty of amperage available, and the 3.3v still came out below 3.2 if I tried to use a DIMM. I honestly think if the internal conversion providing the 3.3 could be fixed or beefed up, you could power a NAOMI quite well from one as long as the 5v supply was solid. You may be on to something with the limited output wires but that could probably be addressed with a custom cable.

All academic for me personally, I usually just play in a JVS cab, but when I had a portable netboot setup it would have been nice to be able to ditch the extra PSU.

 

[twistedsymphony]

have you (or anyone) tried running a DIMM board with the Sega JAMMA converter? not nearly as common as the Capcom I/O but it does perform audio amplification as well as 3.3V conversion.

 

[RealMFnG]

I have same info as everyone here, like triforcetools.py, just was curious enough to read it.
not sure why anyone else can't do this as well, too lazy/stupid probably.

I would just like to see how GDROM's are converted to carts. This is for the 2 or 3 games on GDROM that are staples in my collection. If the info for this is ever made public, I'd convert a few carts just for these games. Then stick with the Dimm's for multi-gaming.

Anyhow, where are you getting your technical information? I am new, so I am curious and would like to learn more.

 

[Mugicha]

I want to clarify that my issue with the Naomi is not about loading times, it is about the fickleness that comes with everything outside of using a standard naomi cart. GD-rom, CF and Netboot, all have their issues with voltage as well as reseating and of course Errors. When I use a cart, it's instant load happiness.

As far as a Multicart, I would not even mind the load times, I don't mind the load times on CF or GD Rom now, what I want is a system that works CONSISTENTLY whenever I choose a game.

and Yes DS, I'm totally willing to drop $400 on it. It would save me so many headaches.

 

[Derick2k]

I want to clarify that my issue with the Naomi is not about loading times, it is about the fickleness that comes with everything outside of using a standard naomi cart. GD-rom, CF and Netboot, all have their issues with voltage as well as reseating and of course Errors. When I use a cart, it's instant load happiness.

As far as a Multicart, I would not even mind the load times, I don't mind the load times on CF or GD Rom now, what I want is a system that works CONSISTENTLY whenever I choose a game.

and Yes DS, I'm totally willing to drop $400 on it. It would save me so many headaches.

 

[pzlate]

I, too, want a cvs2 cart. So yeah, I'd be down for a multicart that stores the last game played for instant booting if possible.

 

[MissionFailed]

Theses are my top ones that I am most after in cart form

Ikaruga
Border Down
Under Defeat
Capcom Vs. SNK 2

don't forget about : Virtua Fighter 4 Final Tuned , Trigger Heart Exelica, Senko no Ronde SP (good game. check out "war tech" on the Xbox360. its the US console port of the first revision.)
Psyvariar 2?, Karous, Melty Blood : Act Cadenza Version B2, ExZeus, Guilty Gear XX Accent Core, Chaos Field. Gigawing 2 is not that cheap of a cart.

and thous are the only ones i can think of off the top of my head.

on the subject of conversion carts:

also, you already have NAOMI flash-carts, it is Melty Blood Actress Again, Radirgy Noa, Dynamite Deka and others who uses Xilinx Spartan FPGA-based 'M4' type cartridges. they all Flash-ROM based and can be reprogrammed to some other game(s).

So what is the total list of carts that can be converted? are there any cheaper, less desired, sport/puzzle game carts with a higher population count that can be use? Is it possible for someone reproduces carts that use Xilinx Spartan FPGA-based 'M4' type with out having to sacrifice an official cart? i guess the cart to MB male to female connector plugs can't be reproduced?

I'm not too excited about cannibalizing Radirgy Noa and Dynamite Deka for conversion carts. We void the market of these carts it's possible that they could become more expensive.

Because of associative value and the reactionary nature of the market, its not uncommon for most of a system games to increases in price after just a few games do.

i would hope there are cheaper cart games on YHJ that would be better candidates for cannibalizing.

 

[MetalliC]

So what is the total list of carts that can be converted?

https://github.com/mamedev/mame/blob/master/src/mame/drivers/naomi.cpp#L644

Is it possible for someone reproduces carts that use Xilinx Spartan FPGA-based 'M4' type with out having to sacrifice an official cart?

everything is possible. but if you expecting it to be cheap - I have bad news for you.
anything custom developed will be several times more expensive than mass production carts (or DIMM) made by Sega, so imo there no sence in this.

 

[MetalliC]

don't forget about : .... ExZeus

anyone ever seen this game running on NAOMI ? or some videos of it running on NAOMI ?

 

[rtw]

It seems to me that you guys are creating a problem where there is none.

You don't want a cart solution because the cart will wear down your contacts (believe me I know)

This is why the official NAOMI kit ships with 4 long screws to secure the cart.

The simplest and less power hungry solution is to use the Compact Flash kit solution. Either with the official SEGA version or another version.

Here is my setup:

. NAOMI 2
. Standard PSU with ATX connector
. ATX adapter JST-VL connectors
. NET version DIMM unit
. Official Compact Flash kit
. Official SEGA GD-ROM drive cable
. A working battery if you want it to start instantly.
. A lot of CF Cards
. Zero Key PIC (Not Network)

Remember that all GD-ROMs can be converted to CF Cards with 100% compatibility.

 

[jassin000]

I think the real question isn't "is this a waste of time/resources given all the options that currently exist" at all...
The issue at hand here, are enough of us willing to pay 400$, and will our hero DS hook it up if so!

Ask any non-video game fan/junky if they think collecting full sized arcade machines in one's home is a waste of time/resources.
For me this hobby/addiction has never been about setting for less than I want, I want that GD Naomi flash cart... Who's down!

 

[deibit]

It seems to me that you guys are creating a problem where there is none.You don't want a cart solution because the cart will wear down your contacts (believe me I know)This is why the official NAOMI kit ships with 4 long screws to secure the cart..

That's why we need a programable cart, permanently plugged to the NAOMI that can be flashed with a USB cable connected to a PC

 

[MissionFailed]

github.com/mamedev/mame/blob/m…me/drivers/naomi.cpp#L644

thanks. really good read.

looks like Melty Blood is the cheapest cart. Not sure if Melty blood fan would care about converting these carts. Don't think many care about the first revision? maybe some hipster will come out of some YT circle and decide it's important. probably not.

Looking at YHJ there now (8/17/16), Six carts are listed at 5,000 yen from one dealer and he has another listed at 8,000 yen. Someone would have to buy only a small few at a time just to keep the price down. 5,000 yen from this seller? after fees going to end up being $70-90 US dollars + shipping. best to hope for cheaper auctions. not void the market.

You don't want a cart solution because the cart will wear down your contacts (believe me I know)

This is why the official NAOMI kit ships with 4 long screws to secure the cart.

that's a really good point. +1 for not switch carts constantly. regardless of someones choice of loading solution.

I'm never a fan of cannibalizing original carts for conversions, if its going to adversely affect the market.

 

[rtw]

looks like Melty Blood is the cheapest cart. Not sure if Melty blood fan would care about converting these carts. Don't think many care about the first revision? maybe some hipster will come out of some YT circle and decide it's important. probably not.

Before you go buy up all the MB carts on YJ I will let you in on a secret. If you were to reprogram this type of cart it would be very very slow.

You would have to write a loader which you insert in the EPROM socket of this cart, then manipulate the boot source jumpers on the cart. The NAOMI would start the loader but you would have to to have some kind of way to serialize the cart info from a PC and "burn" it into FLASH.

 

[keiichi331]

I want to clarify that my issue with the Naomi is not about loading times, it is about the fickleness that comes with everything outside of using a standard naomi cart. GD-rom, CF and Netboot, all have their issues with voltage as well as reseating and of course Errors. When I use a cart, it's instant load happiness.

As far as a Multicart, I would not even mind the load times, I don't mind the load times on CF or GD Rom now, what I want is a system that works CONSISTENTLY whenever I choose a game.

and Yes DS, I'm totally willing to drop $400 on it. It would save me so many headaches.

PREACH ON BROTHA!

 

[Derick2k]

looks like Melty Blood is the cheapest cart. Not sure if Melty blood fan would care about converting these carts. Don't think many care about the first revision? maybe some hipster will come out of some YT circle and decide it's important. probably not.

Before you go buy up all the MB carts on YJ I will let you in on a secret. If you were to reprogram this type of cart it would be very very slow.
You would have to write a loader which you insert in the EPROM socket of this cart, then manipulate the boot source jumpers on the cart. The NAOMI would start the loader but you would have to to have some kind of way to serialize the cart info from a PC and "burn" it into FLASH.

So would the carts that have fewer flash chips from that list make it easier to program? Or would they be processed in the same way.

I never see myself doing this conversion, way above my skillset. Still, I would love to know how Joerg does it.

To anyone that has one of his converted carts, can you post pics of the cart pcb?!

 

[Derick2k]

It seems to me that you guys are creating a problem where there is none.You don't want a cart solution because the cart will wear down your contacts (believe me I know)This is why the official NAOMI kit ships with 4 long screws to secure the cart..

That's why we need a programable cart, permanently plugged to the NAOMI that can be flashed with a USB cable connected to a PC

 

[jassin000]

Yea what deibit said... A Naomi Everdrive, that's what I want.
It will be bolted to that damn Naomi once and for all/ever!